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Modeling Objects in Carrara - Q&A - Come One and All

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  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,551
    TabascoJack said:
    TangoAlpha said:

    There seem to be several different track gauges used by different products. I vaguely recall the Old Station set came with morphing rails so various different trains could use it.

    Thanks for all the comments!

    I don't know if it matches Jack's cars.  Mine is done to standard US rail gauge (1.435m or 4' 8.5").

    I just started my collection of Jack's cars now, starting with this one, the first one, which comes with the track piece and many other cars use parts from this one. For a dollar ninety-nine (PC+) per piece, it just doesn't make sense for me to not try them out, eh?

    The Parkside Passenger Car is old and beaten down, but I have a feeling that we could clean it up pretty nicely if so desired. I'm keeping mine old and run down. But I have a feeling that this track piece would work nicely with yours. Even if we needed to give it a little tweak, I bet it would be really easy.

    So... when can I buy your car (and tracks) to add to my collection? ;)

    If you go through Daz3d, everyone around the world could join me - then you'd be rich!

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,009

    Is there any special trick to seamlessly tiling across material zones? I can 3D paint nicely across it, but... tiling? Ugh.

    I had high hopes for parametric tiling, but it often falls apart for this.

    And I don't want to redo UV maps -- this is for human figures, and it needs to be compatible with other stuff.

     

  • wgdjohnwgdjohn Posts: 2,634
    the3Ddigit said:

    I made a better monorail using a boned cylinder (108 bones on 200 segments)

    now working out orientation of the struts so they do not interfere with the cart's projectory.

    Then can brace them into an ascetially pleasing arrangement that looks structually sound to my eye at least, I am no engineer blush

    Wendy,  Very good indeed!  I really like the option you chose which turned out *very* well.

    Little did I know you wanted a round track... I was thinking double track for an "old timey" roller coaster. :(

    Phil,  In the meantime I experimented with the Ruled Surface tool... didn't take me long to realize that it would take a long time to make all the empty polys and rotations. Then came complete disaster... I stupidly clicked on Bridge tool instead and locked up Carrara when trying to use it... ?what was I thinking?  After an hour waiting for Carrara to respond and perform of give me a requester finally had to shut down it's process down and re-start it.  Darn it... should have saved the template first...*no pic*... didn't have the gumption to start all over.

  • StezzaStezza Posts: 8,051
    edited February 2017

    Using tips from this topic I dived in to model these critters ( as best I could ) for the Carrara Music Challenge 

    thanks members yes
    your shared info is invaluable.

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    Post edited by Stezza on
  • wgdjohnwgdjohn Posts: 2,634
    TabascoJack said:

    So...I think I'm done modeling the wellcar.   Now on to setting up material zones, UV mapping, and texturing....woohoo!

    Waay kewl!   I'd also like to see this available at DAZ... but elsewhere is fine.  It's certainly worthly.

  • StezzaStezza Posts: 8,051

    this is great.. I started on modelling an old train a while ago... I must start again and do it better.. gotta love trains yes

     

    TabascoJack said:

    So...I think I'm done modeling the wellcar.   Now on to setting up material zones, UV mapping, and texturing....woohoo!

     

    And one with a consist and a model for scale...

     

     

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,009
    edited February 2017

    I'm attempting to use Align in modeling room, but it's constantly grayed out/unusable. Any ideas why that might be?

    Edit: Ah, I should do 'Weld, align but do not weld' instead. Got it!

     

    Post edited by Oso3D on
  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 3,311
    edited February 2017

    Select two polygons , one on each mesh,. (ideally the poly's you want to align)

    now hold CTRL+ALT and click to select one of the vertices of the selected poly's,. (this is the align to selection ) { the selected vertex should turn Yellow }

    Now you can go to Edit / Align

    see pic

    that should work better than the weld/align option. that works well on single vertices.

     

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    Post edited by 3DAGE on
  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,548

    Oh my gosh I am so far behind!.....

    lol will try and get caught up this week.

  • wgdjohnwgdjohn Posts: 2,634
    edited February 2017
    3DAGE said:

    Select two polygons , one on each mesh,. (ideally the poly's you want to align)

    now hold CTRL+ALT and click to select one of the vertices of the selected poly's,. (this is the align to selection ) { the selected vertex should turn Yellow }

    Now you can go to Edit / Align

    Andy,   Right away I rushed off to give this a try... No Luck At First and then only every so often...  I created a cube at segments = 2 and then copy/pasted it... no luck at all with this. Next I created an extruded rectangle similar to yours but with filled ends... still no luck so I emptied the top bottom polys of each... and finally had a vertex turn yellow on 2 filled polys like your example.  Obviously I'm doing something wrong since it should be so easy... I'll have to try again sometime until I get to work every time.

    [Edit - Day 2]
    Successfully worked 4 times more easily! Luck, trackball/click-or my thumb&finger, was with me the first time and the one vertices turned Yellow.  2nd time it refused to work until I started over, via Undo - Ctrl+Z, So took a different approach... Shift selected 2 polys... turned Wireframe on... switched to Vertex Selector... then used Ctrl+Alt, Cmd+Alt, even then took a few tries to select a vertices, vertex.  See pics... I used 2 simple spheres.

    Notes: What I've observed, don't know why and learned.

    • After using Ctrl+Alt Carrara seems to enter into another state in which nothing can be selected even after using Align.  By selecting Move... Scale... then Move again things sometimes can be selected again... if not make sure that Polygon Selector is chosen. If this doesn't work next simply Draw Select the objects... and all is well in Carrara Paradise again.
    • Wondering about Ctrl+Alt I purposely didn't select 2 Polys on different meshes first... sure 'nuf the vertex turned yellow... of course now I ponder what other use there could be.
    • If you want to Zoom in on the object... do this before and not while Ctrl+Alt keys are held down.  This isn't surprising since the Alt key is also used to Rotate the objects view.
    • If you want to use Vertex Selector choose this after selecting the 2 Polys and before holding down Ctrl+Alt.
    • Align works fine!  Be aware that it does not auto-resize each poly the same.
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    Post edited by wgdjohn on
  • VarselVarsel Posts: 574
    edited February 2017

    I thought I should mention the use of Crease Edges and Smooth and Convert.

    When modeling something, (as this bus I have just started) the crease edges will help you to get the initial shape of the object.

    This one started out as a cube with object definition at 5.

    I then gave it the basic shape, and then after Smooth (subdivision) and Convert I had a lot more polygons to work with and fine tune the shape.

    This one has still along way to go.

    This bus is hopefully going to be of a Mercedes Benz O322 1959-1964.

    This is one of the buses that I grew up with. And the music challenge got me remembering my first concert. Local bands used to travel around in old buses, and play at community halls (or barns)

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  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,551
    edited February 2017

    I love your models Varsel.This baby looks darned good!

    Ice Dragon Art said:

    Oh my gosh I am so far behind!.....

    lol will try and get caught up this week.

    I hear that! Sheesh! No way I could get caught up in a week though! LOL

     

    3DAGE said:

    Select two polygons , one on each mesh,. (ideally the poly's you want to align)

    now hold CTRL+ALT and click to select one of the vertices of the selected poly's,. (this is the align to selection ) { the selected vertex should turn Yellow }

    Now you can go to Edit / Align

    see pic

    that should work better than the weld/align option. that works well on single vertices.

     

    I Love You, Man!!! Thanks for this! ;)

    Hmnpf... the thinks a thunk never thought!

    Post edited by Dartanbeck on
  • StezzaStezza Posts: 8,051
    edited February 2017

    I've started on my Rail Motor train, I would catch this to and from school way back when.. it's rattling along quite nice except for the shading on some parts .. it gives off a shadowy effect and I don't know why.. check out the render..

    any ideas on how to overcome this or what causes it?

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    Post edited by Stezza on
  • chickenmanchickenman Posts: 1,202
    Varsel said:

     

    This is one of the buses that I grew up with. And the music challenge got me remembering my first concert. Local bands used to travel around in old buses, and play at community halls (or barns)

    I encourage you to submit something to the challenge.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,202

    the lighting I'd say, does it do it with only ambient?

    I think it looks excellent. yes

  • DiomedeDiomede Posts: 15,168
    edited February 2017

    Inspiring transportation options, Jack, Varsel, and Stezza. 

    Varsel, a band traveling by bus during my youth?   (click to see)

    Great start.

    Post edited by Diomede on
  • VarselVarsel Posts: 574
    edited February 2017

    .

    Stezza said:

    I've started on my Rail Motor train, I would catch this to and from school way back when.. it's rattling along quite nice except for the shading on some parts .. it gives off a shadowy effect and I don't know why.. check out the render..

    any ideas on how to overcome this or what causes it?

    Whitout seeing the polygons on your model, I'm guessing here, but this is something I have encounter a lot of time.

    It can even be seen on some of Stonemason's model, if you render them without texture.

    A texturemap can often hide this problem. 

    The problem is lack of polygons/edges at the edges of the model. Carrara will always try to smooth the edges (unless you use crease edges) and with a sharp edge you will get artifacts.

    One way they are avoiding this, in some comercial models, is that the polygons on the edges are not conected. They are aligned but not welded together.

    On my example, the one in the middle, I have used the Fillet Tool in the vertex modeller.

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    Post edited by Varsel on
  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,551

    So the one in the middle, the large pane is separated from the frame that surrounds it? Am I reading this correctly?

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,551

    No... you've used fillet to add extra geometry to the edges, right?

  • VarselVarsel Posts: 574

    Yes, your right. The one in the middle is added geometry by using the Fillet tool. To use separeted polygons is a Poser/Studio trick. Nice to know if you are modeling for export to one of these. I didn't use separeted polygons in any of the examples.

  • TangoAlphaTangoAlpha Posts: 4,584

    With DS and (I think) Poser, you can adjust the smoothing angle in the shader to stop that effect from happening. Don't need to add geometry. Don't think that  functionality is available in Carrara - at least I haven't come across it.

  • PhilWPhilW Posts: 5,145
    TangoAlpha said:

    With DS and (I think) Poser, you can adjust the smoothing angle in the shader to stop that effect from happening. Don't need to add geometry. Don't think that  functionality is available in Carrara - at least I haven't come across it.

    In Carrara, it's not an overall smoothing angle - anything over X degrees is creased, anything under X degrees is smoothed. In Carrara, each line can be creased or smoothed in a more interactive way, but the crease and smooth commands do allow you to set a smoothing angle, so if that's what you want, you can do it easily.

  • VarselVarsel Posts: 574

    In Carrara you can as PhilW says smooth or crease,  if the model is not a rigged Poser/Studio model.

    Content is protected, and you can only move the polygons. And before I am proven wrong ???? there are ways to "unlock" the object. But thats the advanced workflow.

    For most user of Poser/Studio, using the shader to adjust the crease will perhaps also be an advanced options.

    To perhaps be a bit rude, Poser/Studio is : Press Button - Make Art ????

     

     

  • VarselVarsel Posts: 574

    I have just got myself a new tablet with Norwegian spellchecher. And there where also supposed to be a couple of smileys in my last post.

    laugh devil

    Found them....

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,551

    I don't consider that rude at all. It fills a niche. Folks whom don't quite need such a button may still grab the software and its benefits and really go to town with it - and it is renders from these amazing artists which we see in the high-end ads, not stuff created from that Make Art button! ;)

    But you're right. Some of this stuff can become too complicated to explain, I guess.

    Funny... I've never tested the results of it in Daz Studio, but I was playing around with a Genesis 2 morph and, just for kicks, with the topology protection "on", I added creases to the mesh and it let me keep that. I'd really like to see if that gets stored in the SubD info of the mesh upon export and then import back intot the figure as a morph shape change. I'm going to try it one day, just to see.

    But for personal use, we can always just crease edges on our stuff we save to our browser, but even that can seem like more work than one wants to do to a 'bought' product. Either it works as expected or it doesn't. And if it doesn't, we're not likely to load it much anymore unless and idea pops up.

     A couple of workflow options to consider, however.

    I have some purchased goods that I want to use as props, not figures, and yet they come installed as rigged figures - sometimes without really a need for rigging at all. Well this takes away my ability to (ctrl D) duplicate them, which is what I want to do with them. My solution is to use Fenric's Unlock tool and remove the mesh from the rig and delete all but the model, then save it. But if we didn't have Fenric's unlock, we could optimize and store the shader, export it as an obj and just bring i right back in and apply the shader back onto it. Bam. Instant prop.

    With some of the things I've done this to, I've noticed some morphs on the figure. Some things have parts of the rig that are meant to move. In both cases, I check to see what my needs will be - thinking ahead even at extreme cases. But I'm never really losing the original, so it's not too critical.

    So I'll add morphs to my new prop to take over what was included with the original Figure version. Once an item has been unlocked and remove from it's skeleton, we can very easily add morph targets and such very quickly, I love that! Same applies for imported OBJ files. 

    If it's necessary to have the item in two or more parts for, say, spin modifiers and the like, we can easily use more version of it and delete all but the parts this part needs, and put them all together into a single prop which can be duplicated. While it make sound like a lot to do, it all can be done really quickly and easily within Carrara - and with great results and benefits.

     

  • StezzaStezza Posts: 8,051

    Thanks guys.. I used a lot of creasing with the windows and doors... no matter what I use for the shader the shadowing still shows.

    I think I will try and make another attempt at the carriage to try and rectify it by using another method to get the doors and windows and hopefully rectify the problem smiley

    Thanks for the info... it's great

     

     

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  • VarselVarsel Posts: 574

    Well it was perhaps a tiny bit rude. There are people that are making realy stunning pieces of art with Poser/Studio. Far away from what I can do.

    But I am a better modeler than artist. And my experience with the freebies that I have created, is that a lot of the Poser/Studio user are expecting a one click solution for fitting and texturing.

    It is amasing what a good texture can do to improve on a model or hide some imperfections.

    And I have learned to take that into consideration when modeling something that can be used in Poser/Studio.

    I therefor always testrender the models in a flat grey colour (klay texture) just to verifie the topology. And I always try to avoid sharp edges, because I have learned that they can create artifactsand problems.

    Carrara people, living in the land of the Great Daz Studio, with models,rigging and texture/shaders optimized for Studio are used to tweak and adapt for use in our everlasting program of love. heart

  • StezzaStezza Posts: 8,051
    edited February 2017

    remade the carriage and it has seemed to fix the shady shading problem. smiley

     

     

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    Post edited by Stezza on
  • PhilWPhilW Posts: 5,145

    Glad you got it sorted - and looking good!

  • wgdjohnwgdjohn Posts: 2,634
    edited February 2017

    Applause... applause!  You folks are modeling circles around me.... some great looking models!

    Finally I quit procrastinating last night and approached music bars for the Music Challenge... things did not go well... but now I know how not to start.  Over the past week I've grabbed some pics for diff style notes... whole, half, full and others I've long forgotten what their names are. sad  8 years of music study and playing various instruments gone... left behind upon graduation.

    May as well show my disaster last night... vertical lines should be a lot, bit, narrower... perhaps I'll make it same size but spaced further apart... Hmm

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