Daz Studio 5 development update

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  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 101,235

    inquire said:

    Is this an example of the AI we might expect in DAZ Studio? https://www.daz3d.com/face-transfer-2

    The Ai in face transfer is, as far a I know, entirely separate and part of a licensed product rather than something Daz developed.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,271
    edited January 8

    the issue most have with AI is not AI itself AFAIK but the type of model and how it was trained

    DAZ would obviously train anything they use on their own content so that argument is moot

    so those objecting to the use of AI in DAZ studio 5 need to define exactly what it is they are objecting to

    saying they don't like something taking their creative input away etc is as silly as saying they don't want to use premade 3D content itself

    you don't have to use a feature of a software but why gatekeep if others who want it can or cannot have it

    some don't like smart content, I do if it works cheeky which it doesn't on one of my computers

    Post edited by WendyLuvsCatz on
  • richardandtracyrichardandtracy Posts: 5,710
    I think one problem a number of people have with AI is that what is a 'known' limitation today may or may not be a limitation tomorrow. It's moving so fast, just remaining aware of it's capability is almost a full time job. Regards, Richard.
  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 101,235

    This is not the thread for a general discussion of AI.

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,083

    ...some of us still get a sense of enjoyment and even relaxation creating characters by pushing sliders back & forth until we get something we like.  Part of it is a sense of satisfaction, and accomplishment just like I used to get form applying paint to canvas or a pencil to Bristol board.  Another thing I find it relaxing. As long as Daz 5 lets me continue do the same, I'm  fine with it (though I am concerned about certain plugins I use with the sdk update).

    As long as it recognises the content I currently have, as well as the workflow I use that's all fine. There are tools in the current version I don't use (like animation and Smart Content) so I pretty much expect the same option will be true in Daz5.  Of course this is all dependent on whether I can afford the system upgrade to use it.

  • richardandtracyrichardandtracy Posts: 5,710
    edited January 9

    I must admit, I'd really appreciate a gaming quality renderer as an alternative to Filament/Texture Shaded for posing. My only real concern with Filament is the treatment of transparency and normals and as such it can become confusing with many hairs. In most hairs the normals behave as if they point towards the character, so are subject to back face culling, Filament's treatment of hair then seems to hollow it out. If DS could use the Unity or similar game engine, it'd be possible to have fast posing, reasonable rendering (as with Filament) but without Filament's confusing treatment of hair.

    If I were to have a 'Would be nice..' list, I'll enumerate it below. I won't call it a 'Wishlist' because DS4 with Ultrascenery meets almost every hope I have of it. OK, maybe Item 1 is a wishlist item because it's badly needed:

    1. Proper documentation explaining every feature with examples.
    2. Gaming quality renderer.
    3. Ability to natively model items from scratch.
    4. Ability to natively texture map items from scratch.
    5. More comprehensive mesh editing in the program.
    6. In the Filament renderer, default to an ISO level of 0.2 rather than 1.00 as it's the brightness closest to what you see when rendering with Iray.

    I can't see that DS5 would abandon sliders. They were in the Beta DS0.7 releases, so it's unlikely they'd be removed. Well, I hope it's unlikely. And to make DS5 incompatible with large swathes of previous content would not be a very sound business decision based on how many people have invested large amounts in content. I think that's unlikely. If/when the script engine changes I can see that scripts can break. With extra programming effort from DAZ, the old scripts could be run, but it'd need DAZ to write an interpreter to make DS4 scripts seem like DS5 scripts to DS5 as they are run. That is, frankly, probably too much effort/cost for DAZ to reasonably fund.

    Regards

    Richard

    Post edited by richardandtracy on
  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,271

    that's sounding a lot like Carrara...

  • GordigGordig Posts: 10,091

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    that's sounding a lot like Carrara...

    Or, you know, basically anything besides DS.

  • richardandtracyrichardandtracy Posts: 5,710
    edited January 9

    May I just say again, it's a 'Would be nice..' list. Apart from Item 1, which is massively overdue.

    As for Carrara, I have been looking at it, and trying to find evidence for written documentation. Which is something I'm finding hard to do, as much was on a Wiki which seems to have been good in 2012, but there are a lot of broken links now.

    Regards,

    Richard.

     

    Post edited by richardandtracy on
  • richardandtracyrichardandtracy Posts: 5,710

    That one file has come close to selling it to me. Thanks for the link.

    Regards,

    Richard

  • a51_aliena51_alien Posts: 15
    edited January 19

    I saw this in the installer 

    then I found this thread, and my hopes were broken... like the past 5 years of dForce AMD compatability...

    image_2024-01-19_152526275.png
    1371 x 752 - 36K
    Post edited by a51_alien on
  • richardandtracyrichardandtracy Posts: 5,710
    edited January 21

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    Carrara has a ...gasp   manual 

    http://docs.daz3d.com/lib/exe/fetch.php/artzone/pub/software/carrara/carrara7_user_guide.pdf

    Thanks  Wendy. It was enough to convince me to buy it yesterday while at a discounted price. I was able to model more in 15 minutes with Cararra than I managed in 8 hours with Blender. 

    Regards

    Richard 

    Post edited by richardandtracy on
  • Saxa -- SDSaxa -- SD Posts: 872

    richardandtracy said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    Carrara has a ...gasp   manual 

    http://docs.daz3d.com/lib/exe/fetch.php/artzone/pub/software/carrara/carrara7_user_guide.pdf

    Thanks  Wendy. It was enough to convince me to buy it yesterday while at a discounted price. I was able to model more in 15 minutes with Cararra than I managed in 8 hours with Blender. 

    Regards

    Richard 

    Thank you to you both.

    Just bought 8.5 pro. Price was super great today.   :)

    With all the things that Carrara can do, am sure will be useful for something.  Looking around quick, seemed like a logical parent of DS with lots of similar commands. For a few modelling projects, look forward to the familiarity.  Blender was not my cup of tea either.  Glad it's there. Just not for me.

     

     

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,271
    edited January 22

    Carrara also has a lot in common with Hexagon 

    without the need for validating everything 

    and freezing and crashing 

    Hexagon can do some stuff Carrara cannot but not enough for me to torture myself in it

    I often try to use it and do have enormous respect for those who model in it as their work is awesome but it just has never played nice for me on any computer 

    Carrara is certainly not above freezing and crashing but nowhere near as much as Hexagon does for me

    to get back on topic

    if only D|S5 could include vertex modelling options those who don't want can hide

    (rather than moan about it like they do when it's suggested)

    DAZ owns 2 wonderful programs to poach from

    Post edited by WendyLuvsCatz on
  • GordigGordig Posts: 10,091

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    DAZ owns 2 wonderful programs to poach from

    I'm surprised you didn't include Bryce.  

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,271
    edited January 22

    Gordig said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    DAZ owns 2 wonderful programs to poach from

    I'm surprised you didn't include Bryce.  

    thanks, I actually think an iray or at least any GPU driven render engine addon to Bryce would be awesome, my main gripe with it is the working in wireframe and slowness of rendering 

    adding it to D|S5 would certainly also be awesome 

    I was mainly thinking of modelling capabilities for D|S but yes the other features of Carrara and Bryce some of which are already being addressed by PAs are great additions 

    Alberto recently added booleans which Bryce has

    Post edited by WendyLuvsCatz on
  • Robert FreiseRobert Freise Posts: 4,458
    edited January 22

    I never got Hex to work past two functions. It crashed every time

    Really liked Carrara I used it before Daz took it over

    Post edited by Robert Freise on
  • Saxa -- SDSaxa -- SD Posts: 872

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    Carrara also has a lot in common with Hexagon

    Nice to hear Hex & Carrara have alot in common.
    Hex is just an awesome program for quick morph-making.
    So have hopes for Carrara for some things.

    Hopefully DS5 will include an option to select what to send to Hex (or Zbrush).
    Right now if send base g8f, it auto-sends all children.
    Would be so nice for DS5 to have option to toggle this and not that.
    Right now, Little bit more work for spontaneous morphs.

    See you wrote in another thread (2021) that Carrara needs blended weights?
    Saw in Carrara 8.5 pro features that General Weights are seamless fit?
    Just trying to figure out what can do and not.
    Tried an ultra simple 3ds import from Carrara (not .obj) and looked good.

    btw. the displacement painting, 3d paiting and bullet physics looked intriguing too.

     

  • StezzaStezza Posts: 8,102

    richardandtracy said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    Carrara has a ...gasp   manual 

    http://docs.daz3d.com/lib/exe/fetch.php/artzone/pub/software/carrara/carrara7_user_guide.pdf

    Thanks  Wendy. It was enough to convince me to buy it yesterday while at a discounted price. I was able to model more in 15 minutes with Cararra than I managed in 8 hours with Blender. 

    Regards

    Richard 

    come to the Carrara boards ... we have cake wink 

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,271
    edited January 22

    Saxa -- SD said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    Carrara also has a lot in common with Hexagon

    Nice to hear Hex & Carrara have alot in common.
    Hex is just an awesome program for quick morph-making.
    So have hopes for Carrara for some things.

    Hopefully DS5 will include an option to select what to send to Hex (or Zbrush).
    Right now if send base g8f, it auto-sends all children.
    Would be so nice for DS5 to have option to toggle this and not that.
    Right now, Little bit more work for spontaneous morphs.

    See you wrote in another thread (2021) that Carrara needs blended weights?
    Saw in Carrara 8.5 pro features that General Weights are seamless fit?
    Just trying to figure out what can do and not.
    Tried an ultra simple 3ds import from Carrara (not .obj) and looked good.

    btw. the displacement painting, 3d paiting and bullet physics looked intriguing too.

     

    Carrara actually uses quaternions just not ones compatible with the DAZ studio flavour

    there are typos in the hidden naming of bones in Genesis 3 and 8/8.5 that crash Carrara that were fixed in Genesis 9 (or rather not misnamed in the matching hidden node) https://www.renderosity.com/forums/comments/4312857/permalink

    Mistylara fixed them in DSON editor but (notepad should work too) on the base character files but sadly she pulled her genesis 3 characters from the Renderosity marketplace

    and has been MIA for a couple years (am very concerned)

    she has a freebie for Genesis 8.1 up still

    https://www.renderosity.com/freestuff/items/88523/carrara-presets-for-genesis-81?AID=4737

     

    Post edited by WendyLuvsCatz on
  • Wish that Daz 5 would add decals with emission :D

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 101,235

    MetalSunde94 said:

    Wish that Daz 5 would add decals with emission :D

    As far as I know that would require nVidia to add decals with emission so that Daz could expose them in DS.

  • Saxa -- SDSaxa -- SD Posts: 872

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    Carrara actually uses quaternions just not ones compatible with the DAZ studio flavour

    there are typos in the hidden naming of bones in Genesis 3 and 8/8.5 that crash Carrara that were fixed in Genesis 9 (or rather not misnamed in the matching hidden node) https://www.renderosity.com/forums/comments/4312857/permalink

    Mistylara fixed them in DSON editor but (notepad should work too) on the base character files but sadly she pulled her genesis 3 characters from the Renderosity marketplace

    and has been MIA for a couple years (am very concerned)

    she has a freebie for Genesis 8.1 up still

    https://www.renderosity.com/freestuff/items/88523/carrara-presets-for-genesis-81?AID=4737

    Sorry to hear Mistylara is MIA :(.

    Thanks alot for all that handy info & links!  Looked and saved.
    If I end up using Carrara 8.5pro for any G8 work, would probably fix those names and post at Rendo for G8, assuming any interest.
    With that link, most of the ID of issue seems already done.
    Different Quaternions - good to know.

    Thanks for also being an unofficial Carrara archivist :)

    As for DS5, so many wishes for features.
    We are only on 4.22.*.*.
    So maybe lots of time yet ;)
    In meantime, enjoying the DS beta addons. :)

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,271

    Saxa -- SD said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    Carrara actually uses quaternions just not ones compatible with the DAZ studio flavour

    there are typos in the hidden naming of bones in Genesis 3 and 8/8.5 that crash Carrara that were fixed in Genesis 9 (or rather not misnamed in the matching hidden node) https://www.renderosity.com/forums/comments/4312857/permalink

    Mistylara fixed them in DSON editor but (notepad should work too) on the base character files but sadly she pulled her genesis 3 characters from the Renderosity marketplace

    and has been MIA for a couple years (am very concerned)

    she has a freebie for Genesis 8.1 up still

    https://www.renderosity.com/freestuff/items/88523/carrara-presets-for-genesis-81?AID=4737

    Sorry to hear Mistylara is MIA :(.

    Thanks alot for all that handy info & links!  Looked and saved.
    If I end up using Carrara 8.5pro for any G8 work, would probably fix those names and post at Rendo for G8, assuming any interest.
    With that link, most of the ID of issue seems already done.
    Different Quaternions - good to know.

    Thanks for also being an unofficial Carrara archivist :)

    As for DS5, so many wishes for features.
    We are only on 4.22.*.*.
    So maybe lots of time yet ;)
    In meantime, enjoying the DS beta addons. :)

    I tried looking myself but too much to go through and of course I have Misty's characters, there are a few other issues with weightmapping on a foot that manifests in FBX exports to other programs too

  • Saxa -- SDSaxa -- SD Posts: 872
    edited January 23

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    I tried looking myself but too much to go through and of course I have Misty's characters, there are a few other issues with weightmapping on a foot that manifests in FBX exports to other programs too

    Is there a best thread for  this kind of Carrarra chat, should i go further with it for G8 (as opposed to just modelling non-figures which is current focus)? 

    Post edited by Saxa -- SD on
  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,271
    edited January 23

    Saxa -- SD said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    I tried looking myself but too much to go through and of course I have Misty's characters, there are a few other issues with weightmapping on a foot that manifests in FBX exports to other programs too

    Is there a best thread for  this kind of Carrarra chat, should i go further with it for G8 (as opposed to just modelling non-figures which is current focus)? 

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/432566/genesis-8-and-carrara 

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/355126/genesis-8-in-carrara/p1

    are some but assume you have Misty's character preset

    honestly though I would render a png image series with alpha in DAZ studio and put them on a plane or splat because Carrara also does animated texture with alpha

    I do this quite often myself

    I own Octane Render 4 Carrara which is the only reason why I bother using the later charactors at all for animation

    stills an obj import posed would suffice and an obj export from D|S can have draped Dforce clothing, HD morphs, geografts etc

    if you do want to use charactors rigged in Carrara up to Genesis 2 is supported natively and most of the legacy stuff works, geografts don't and a few very D|S specific things don't

    or just render backgrounds for DAZ studio, I do that too

    or animated backgrounds to add in post

    Carrara scenes are awesome with replicators, terrain, trees, particles, physics etc

    if you like vast folders of files The Mystery is the Point's Sagan does obj series exports and a plugin from Digital Carvers Guild now free and opensource will import obj series frame by frame which gets you totally HD characters with their exported Dforce clothing simulations etc one obj at a time loaded and rendered (just as fast as any animated render)

    Carrara is faster than 3Delight and honestly if going PBR not important faster than iray

    Post edited by WendyLuvsCatz on
  • Interesting some more development from the change log seems we might be getting closer to a major update. Maybe  Daz 5 ?  But would not hold your hopes up laugh

    • Source maintenance

    • Extended DzPane SDK API; added metatype/typedef for QPointer<DzPane>, DzWeakPanePtr

    • Added OmniSurface shaders

      • ./shaders/iray/nvidia/OmniSurface/OmniHair.mdl

      • ./shaders/iray/nvidia/OmniSurface/OmniHairBase.mdl

      • ./shaders/iray/nvidia/OmniSurface/OmniShared.mdl

      • ./shaders/iray/nvidia/OmniSurface/OmniSurface.mdl

      • ./shaders/iray/nvidia/OmniSurface/OmniSurfaceBase.mdl

    • Addressed issues with localization

    • Addressed issues with anonymous logging

    DAZ Studio : Incremented build number to 4.22.1.62

  • Saxa -- SDSaxa -- SD Posts: 872

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    Saxa -- SD said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    I tried looking myself but too much to go through and of course I have Misty's characters, there are a few other issues with weightmapping on a foot that manifests in FBX exports to other programs too

    Is there a best thread for  this kind of Carrarra chat, should i go further with it for G8 (as opposed to just modelling non-figures which is current focus)? 

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/432566/genesis-8-and-carrara 

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/355126/genesis-8-in-carrara/p1

    are some but assume you have Misty's character preset

    honestly though I would render a png image series with alpha in DAZ studio and put them on a plane or splat because Carrara also does animated texture with alpha

    I do this quite often myself

    I own Octane Render 4 Carrara which is the only reason why I bother using the later charactors at all for animation

    stills an obj import posed would suffice and an obj export from D|S can have draped Dforce clothing, HD morphs, geografts etc

    if you do want to use charactors rigged in Carrara up to Genesis 2 is supported natively and most of the legacy stuff works, geografts don't and a few very D|S specific things don't

    or just render backgrounds for DAZ studio, I do that too

    or animated backgrounds to add in post

    Carrara scenes are awesome with replicators, terrain, trees, particles, physics etc

    if you like vast folders of files The Mystery is the Point's Sagan does obj series exports and a plugin from Digital Carvers Guild now free and opensource will import obj series frame by frame which gets you totally HD characters with their exported Dforce clothing simulations etc one obj at a time loaded and rendered (just as fast as any animated render)

    Carrara is faster than 3Delight and honestly if going PBR not important faster than iray

    that's like a treasure trove of info!  thank you so much! heart

    Saved it.  Will go through as it pops up with my creations. 

    Have a great day!

     

     

     

  • robertswwwrobertswww Posts: 790

    I hope that one of Daz Studio 5's new AI features is ​AI Tracking Facial Data for 3D Animation (also accepting guidance from text inputs). Check out this clip to see what it might look like...

    Media2Face: Co-speech Facial Animation Generation With Multi-Modality Guidance
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugTYqTZSlfg

    - and - 

    Sora, the OpenAI text-to-video model:
    https://openai.com/sora

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