Best CPU for modelling

Rufus Coppertop

In doing some research re best CPU for modeling, I've come across of factors:

- multi cores are great for rendering BUT for modeling, single-core-performance is THE THING.

- high performance per core might be good but too many cores can create a thermal bottleneck slowing and thereby slow it all down.

So I'm wondering - Am I being a bit simplistic in assuming that a CPU with fewer cores is necessarily going to be better?

I can afford a Ryzen 9 7950X which has 16 cores 4.5 ghz base speed and 5.7 maximum plus 64 mb L3 Cache.

But - for the sake of modeling - might I be better off with the Ryzen 6 7600X which only has 6 cores?             (4.7 ghz base speed and 5.3 max and 32 gb cache)

 

Expozures

Daz hardly uses the CPU at all.  I recently upgraded from an i9-9900K to an i9-12900KS.

I went from 8 cores/16 threads to 8+8E cores/24 threads.  3.6Ghz to 5Ghz.  3200MT/S DDR4 RAM to 6000MT/S DDR5 RAM.  My sample render that I setup took 20 minutes...after the upgrade...took 20 minutes.

FSMCDesigns

In my experience modeling (Not the same thing as rendering) really doesn't impact a system much unless you are working with really heavy amd dense meshes and then it can be app specific as to what components make a differrence. What modeling apps are you thinking of using?

Richard Haseltine

What application(s) would you be using to model?

nonesuch00

I can still box model in Blender using a Toshiba M205 PC Tablet from 2003.

richardandtracy

In November I checked processors quite a a lot, I compared single thread speed between Intel and AMD, and came to the conclusion that at almost every level Intel were faster in single threads for the price (in the UK at least at the time). Multi threading, the difference between Intel and AMD was much less clear cut, but as the GPU would handle the multi threading bits I needed, I was less bothered. I ended up with a new machine with an i5-13600KF. Roughly the same single thread speed as an i7-12gen and i9-11gen, but cheaper. Regards, Richard.

nonesuch00

richardandtracy said:

In November I checked processors quite a a lot, I compared single thread speed between Intel and AMD, and came to the conclusion that at almost every level Intel were faster in single threads for the price (in the UK at least at the time). Multi threading, the difference between Intel and AMD was much less clear cut, but as the GPU would handle the multi threading bits I needed, I was less bothered. I ended up with a new machine with an i5-13600KF. Roughly the same single thread speed as an i7-12gen and i9-11gen, but cheaper. Regards, Richard.

Also, I read this week that the new generation of Intel products coming out in 2024 (a bit late for this user's purchase) that Intel will have both the single core performance and multithread performance crowns again as they shift to a combo of performance core and efficient core chipliet arrays on CPU dies. Of course, maybe AMD while come up with something before then that wins back the crowns but nothing AMD currently has in a public roadmap matches the 2024 Intel roadmap. 

Currently: Intel has the single core crown and AMD the multithread crown. For the OP's question - neither matter to you as no one could possible box model so fast as to cause a CPU core to lag trying to stay caught up with all of your edge extrudes.  If you are a heavy and professional gamer then you need to really deep dived about that stuff, but otherwise no.

richardandtracy

I do agree with @nonesuch00 up to a point that the single thread performance isn't hugely important when modelling. The reason for this is that the thinking time of the modeller is much more than the processor time needed for particular jobs. BUT, I have worked with some massive models in SolidWorks (converted to .obj they are 70+ million facets), a program that is almost entirely single threaded. When doing that, better single thread performance reduces the amount you chew your knuckles in frustration waiting for the machine to react to the mouse click up to 35 seconds ago. My new machine is around 4, maybe 8 times faster than my old one and huge models only take 5-10 seconds before I get a response. Just so much less wearing. Have to admit it's usually me slowing everything down, though. It would be much better to have a multi-thread modeller, but I don't know of one yet. Regards, Richard

CAV_18687

I hope I'm not repeating something somebody has already said, but zbrush doesn't use your graphics card, or if it does now its not for the core purpose of the software, hence if youre using zbrush or might in future, CPU  performance is paramount, so a good place to look or ask would be experienced zbrush groups.  I've had no problems with an i9K129000, so thats 16 cores, 24 threads, but im no expert, not by a long shot.  My point is basically to give reassurance that we are not talking threadripper level workstations to use zbrush to a decent extent ...

https://www.cgdirector.com/best-workstation-pc-for-zbrush/

http://www.cgdirector.com/best-workstation-pc-for-zbrush/

Rufus Coppertop

Richard Haseltine said:

What application(s) would you be using to model?

Marvelous Designer 9 and Blender.

Blender's pretty okay on the setup I have which includes an AMD FX 8320 processor.

The slowness in MD though is enraging, infuriating demoralizing and has precipitated a couple of nicotine relapses a few years ago. It sucks all the joy out of the possibility offered by MD and just bleeeeeh.

I want a system that works for Blender AND for MD. One where you can actually enjoy learning the processes and practicing and getting better at it and actually making stuff.

 

Rufus Coppertop

nonesuch00 said:

I can still box model in Blender using a Toshiba M205 PC Tablet from 2003.

I should have specified that the problem I have is with Marvelous Designer.

outrider42

You might want to look up some hardware reviews that discuss the software you want to use. Every software can be different, and there plenty of cases where a software is more optimized for a certain CPU than another, even if the other CPU is technically better. There is no clear cut one CPU to rule them all. They each can have advantages and disadvantages. AMD might be better with some software, while Intel might be better at others. The energy used can vary up as well. You may see reviewers say the new Intel chips use a ton of power, but that is not necessarily true. Intel can idle very low, and there a number of tasks where they are indeed more efficient. There are some tasks where the built in GPU or decoder on Intel come into play and boost performance dramatically, though these tend to be with photo or video editing software. But there might be modeling software that do take advantage of the Intel iGPU in some way.

nonesuch00

Rufus Coppertop said:

nonesuch00 said:

I can still box model in Blender using a Toshiba M205 PC Tablet from 2003.

I should have specified that the problem I have is with Marvelous Designer.

Marvelous Designer has with each version past MD 9, further optimized MD for nVidia & now AMD GPUs. Also CPU optimizations but not nearly as good. Use lower details in MD modeling & similations.

I suppose it is too late for you to upgrade MD to MD 11 & then MD 12? 

woofer

Rufus Coppertop said:

In doing some research re best CPU for modeling, I've come across of factors:

- multi cores are great for rendering BUT for modeling, single-core-performance is THE THING.

- high performance per core might be good but too many cores can create a thermal bottleneck slowing and thereby slow it all down.

Thermal bottlenecks should not really be an issue as long as you have a quality CPU cooler that's properly installed. Watercooling is obviously an option, but even a high end air cooler, e.g. something from Noctua, should provide you with enough cooling for any CPU (the NH-D15 or NH-D15S are probably the best air coolers on the market).

The other point I'd make is that temperatures/throttling only become an issue during all core workloads. So, if your primary focus is high single-threaded performance, then it sounds like the other cores won't be heavily utilized, and so temperatures shouldn't be a concern. At the same time, if the other cores are going to be utilized, then you probably do want the additional cores, since it's a multi-threaded task.

So it sounds to me like you're overthinking it. Just get a good cooler, and a CPU with enough cores to satisfy your workloads. Downgrading on core counts is unlikely to offer any single-threaded gains. As mentioned by some others, Intel has a slight advantage on single-threaded performance at the expense of worse efficiency and slightly worse multi-threaded performance. On the other hand, AMD is about to release 7000X3D CPUs this month. That said, the X3D CPUs will have more cache at the expense of slower clock frequencies, so while they will likely have better gaming performance, it's hard to say if they will be better or worse for your purposes.

Rufus Coppertop

nonesuch00 said:

Rufus Coppertop said:

nonesuch00 said:

I can still box model in Blender using a Toshiba M205 PC Tablet from 2003.

I should have specified that the problem I have is with Marvelous Designer.

Marvelous Designer has with each version past MD 9, further optimized MD for nVidia & now AMD GPUs. Also CPU optimizations but not nearly as good. Use lower details in MD modeling & similations.

I suppose it is too late for you to upgrade MD to MD 11 & then MD 12? 

I have a perpetual license for MD 9 and I think that entitles me to update as far as version 12 and still retain perpetual license.

Rufus Coppertop

woofer said:

Rufus Coppertop said:

In doing some research re best CPU for modeling, I've come across of factors:

- multi cores are great for rendering BUT for modeling, single-core-performance is THE THING.

- high performance per core might be good but too many cores can create a thermal bottleneck slowing and thereby slow it all down.

Thermal bottlenecks should not really be an issue as long as you have a quality CPU cooler that's properly installed. Watercooling is obviously an option, but even a high end air cooler, e.g. something from Noctua, should provide you with enough cooling for any CPU (the NH-D15 or NH-D15S are probably the best air coolers on the market).

The other point I'd make is that temperatures/throttling only become an issue during all core workloads. So, if your primary focus is high single-threaded performance, then it sounds like the other cores won't be heavily utilized, and so temperatures shouldn't be a concern. At the same time, if the other cores are going to be utilized, then you probably do want the additional cores, since it's a multi-threaded task.

So it sounds to me like you're overthinking it. Just get a good cooler, and a CPU with enough cores to satisfy your workloads. Downgrading on core counts is unlikely to offer any single-threaded gains. As mentioned by some others, Intel has a slight advantage on single-threaded performance at the expense of worse efficiency and slightly worse multi-threaded performance. On the other hand, AMD is about to release 7000X3D CPUs this month. That said, the X3D CPUs will have more cache at the expense of slower clock frequencies, so while they will likely have better gaming performance, it's hard to say if they will be better or worse for your purposes.

I probably am overthinking it and I'm going to take your advice. I'll go with Intel and get the best Nvidia GPU  I can afford plus some seriously good cooling. And at least 64 Gig cache and a monstrously big hard drive. Multi terabytes. And a fabulous motherboard of course.

gniiial

Expozures said:

Daz hardly uses the CPU at all.  I recently upgraded from an i9-9900K to an i9-12900KS.

I went from 8 cores/16 threads to 8+8E cores/24 threads.  3.6Ghz to 5Ghz.  3200MT/S DDR4 RAM to 6000MT/S DDR5 RAM.  My sample render that I setup took 20 minutes...after the upgrade...took 20 minutes.

That's what I also experienced, even thouh, the processes overall on the computer get more responsive! Like working with psd, daz and blender at the same time, switching back and fourth, skinning, shading, importing, exporting stuff...  But at this level (16-24 cores and above 64 GB DDR) this would not make a huge difference anymore. It's kind of like with the setup. If someone would still use a old HDD with a powerful setup like that, this person would not be able to use this power as long as the data is not "available". And even if it's available, there are still limitations, like the smaller the files, the more often there will be nothing to do... Kind of like driving a really powerfull car in an area with way to many trafficlights. Sometimes it's not the traffic that slows down, sometimes it's "getting up to speed" again, slowing down again, getting up to speed again... You can see it with extracting or copying larger amounts of files (20-300 GB)...  There are so many aspects that make upgrading unnecessary, like the powerconsumption, the most people don't think of. Yes, it can be great to have a brand new 8 GB or 12 GB Grafics card, but slower cards, with the same amount of ram, cost less and don't need upgrades for the power adapter. If the scene one has build reaches the limit of the ram, it's back again on the cpu setup... Even if its a card that uses 300 watts+ and is from the newest generation available. Those are only fast as hell, when the scene fits the Ram they have...
Oh, and whats the most time consumption on creating stuff?! Right... creating stuff... 

WendyLuvsCatz

depends entirely on the modeller you use

some need lots of RAM others have GPU accelleration

Carrara for instance prefers my PC with the GPU card and lots of RAM, Blender my PC with the more powerful CPU but it can only run 2.# as Win7

nonesuch00

Rufus Coppertop said:

nonesuch00 said:

Rufus Coppertop said:

nonesuch00 said:

I can still box model in Blender using a Toshiba M205 PC Tablet from 2003.

I should have specified that the problem I have is with Marvelous Designer.

Marvelous Designer has with each version past MD 9, further optimized MD for nVidia & now AMD GPUs. Also CPU optimizations but not nearly as good. Use lower details in MD modeling & similations.

I suppose it is too late for you to upgrade MD to MD 11 & then MD 12? 

I have a perpetual license for MD 9 and I think that entitles me to update as far as version 12 and still retain perpetual license.

Well, there is the primary solution to your problem. Other things help but MD has added much AMD GPU support since MD 9 and the nVidia support is much better too.