dForce Joy Hair Sim Error
Phatmartino
Posts: 287
Hey guys, I just grabbed https://www.daz3d.com/dforce-joy-hair-for-genesis-8-females and went to do a dForce Sim and it just immediately comes up with this:
Simulation Error
Error preparing objects to simulate and collide.
I tried it on a freshly loaded Gen 8 Basic Female with no morphs or pose and all attempts come up with that Error. I next tried loading a different dForce Hair and it Simmed normally...
Here's what the Log File had to say:
2022-01-06 09:58:43.074 WARNING: ..\..\..\src\dzdynamicsengine.cpp(426): Using device: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060 SUPER
2022-01-06 09:58:44.295 WARNING: ..\..\..\src\dzdynamicsengine.cpp(2691): ERROR: clCreateBuffer (-61)
2022-01-06 09:58:44.381 Total Simulation Time: 1.30 seconds
Any thoughts as to something that could be the prob on my end would be appreciated, or if it seems more like something that needs to be looked at, should I submit a ticket? I've never done so, so any advice as to what all info I would need to provide would also be appreciated. Thanks!
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Comments
Your situation could be entirely different, but I had a similar issue with a different product. Customer service told me that although it was "dForce hair", it was not intended to be simulated. (Huh? I returned it.) There is almost no information on that product page at all. The link to (I assume) a video does not work for me in Chrome or Firefox. None of the promo images show any indication of simulation being done, as far as I can tell.
Ah, very good to know that that's a possibility!
You're right that there's very little as far as description, though this is one of the two sentences:
"The product is made for dForce but works well in most poses as conforming"
I wouldn't even worry about it, but to load the hair, it seemed a little silly looking as though it were all pushed up a little waiting to be simulated...
I agree, that sentence certainly implies an option other than conforming, i,e. dForce simulation. It could be that the response I got from customer service was inaccurate. I don't know if they consulted the PA or just winged it. You'd probably better submit a ticket to ask about the issue with Joy Hair.
That error will pop up from time to time. I have never figured out what it's exactly related to, but if you save your scene, close DAZ, wait for it to be all the way closed, and then reopen your scene, it very well may work fine.
Also very good to know this could be a solution if I see this again...
I just gave that a try with no luck. I know exactly what you mean about making sure DS is fully closed, I close and re-open for varies reasons constantly and found out quickly that I had to wait for DS to clear from the Task Manager, etc.
I was waiting around just a bit before going through the process of submitting a Ticket, to see if someone might recognize that the Error from the Log looked like maybe I don't have enough memory or something...
I only have an 8G 2060S video card and 16G of Sytem Memory. I've never had this prob with anything dForce before, but adding this hair initially to a cutom figure made my Viewport laggy like I may have never seen before either...
It would seem to me that any product with "dForce" in the name or product description would be sold with the explicit intent to be simulated. Why else would somebody create a product that uses the dForce engine? Couldn't that be false advertising? I'd hope this customer service person was mistaken.
It could also be a way of getting strand-based hair, without indending that it be dynamic.
That may be what is going on, but marketing needs to make that clear in the product description, if they are selling a "dForce" item that does not support simulation. I think 100% of customers expect a "dForce" product to support simulation.
This reminds me of outfits sold as "dForce", when only one small section of one small piece of the whole outfit has simulation. I always feel misled when such a product is marketed as dForce, without any explanation of the fact that the majority of the product does not support simulation at all. Similarly, I would feel misled by a dForce hair that does not simulate - which is why I returned the one I purchased.
It's a problem of branding: when Daz released the new hair system, they decided to call it dForce hair, but they could have called it anything. Yes, "dForce hair" can be simulated (even if the creator didn't intend it to be so), but if someone makes a hair using that system that they don't intend to be simulated, they're still stuck with the dForce name. It would potentially be even more confusing if someone released a hair using that system that they didn't label as dForce, because then a whole bunch of people would be wondering why it doesn't show up in an Iray preview, or when they export as an FBX. The latter scenario has definitely happened as well, for the record.
Daz also did an oopsie when they decided to name G8.1's new skin shader "PBRskin", which would be fine as is, but basically everyone refers to it simply as PBR. This created unnecessary confusion, with users thinking that it's a whole new render engine distinct from Iray, or referring to shaders as either Iray or PBR, when Iray is a PBR engine. The problem could potentially have been mitigated by employing some editorial control over product copy and insisting that all references to the new shader called it PBRskin rather than simply PBR.
I seem to be having the same problem (same error message and all). I am still on DAZ Studio 4.15, though, so maybe that's the problem.
It's a shame, just as I thought I could go back to buying that vendor's products. Now I gotta blacklist them again.
and not all "dforce hair" is strandbased, I actually prefer the ones that are not
IE clothbased
I didn't even think about the fact that I am also using 4.15... Thought I'd at least mention we have that in common in this issue, though I'm not sure what could be different about this hair from all others we have, that work in 4.15...
@WendyLuvsCatz I 100% agree with your preference. They usually look better and there's no heavy loading PR preview/Line Tesselation mumbo jumbo that, for me at least, is one of the few things that ever bog down my viewport. I can't do with leaving PR preview off and not really seeing what things look like before a final render.
Question for anyone willing... Is it possible to quote multiple posts? Couldn't see how in Chrome, at least...
Only by quoting one, copying the result, quoting the next, pasting in the first reply, and repeating as needed.
What is the sense in creating a "dForce Hair" without the ability to dForce? If I am going for that kind of hair, it is because I want to "hand over" a part of posing the hair to the gravity of the simulation engine. That might also explain the silence from tech support. Asking for a refund now, since a "dForce Hair" without "dForce" is a defect product (Absence of a warranted characteristic)
Looking into it just enough to remind myself of what Propschick Hair assets I have and how any of these details are handled on any of those product pages, there's a lot of variation.
Some say compatible software is "dForce Hair", some say "dForce Cloth"... One of the 13 of Propschick's Hair Assets that I own is simmable but does not have "dForce" in the Product Name.
Also, the quoted line in my first post from this product's details that says the hair was made for dForce, but can work with most conforming, etc, etc... was quoted from a past product's details, lack of punctuation and all.
Am I to understand from Richard's first response that dForce can be used in the creation of strand based hair in order to achieve the final look that will be sold, but isn't intended to be Dynamic on the user end? I can totally understand that, though I would agree that QA should be looking for this situation and making sure the Product Page says somewhere that it is not Dynamic, intended for Simulation, or whatever. Maybe also revisit the naming convention rules mentioned above that could be exacerbating the problem. There's at least no reason to have "dForce" in the Product Title if every customer who buys it is almost surely going to be expecting to be able to simulate.
Thanks for the tip on the multi-quoting, Richard. Not happy to hear that's the solution, but happy there is a solution at all. :)
So I would summarize:
There is the word dForce in the product title. The dForce Modifier is applied to the surfaces of the item. It will not simulate. For me at least, the suggestion of restarting DAZ Studio does not work. And the error log is not helpful.
I tried simulating only one surface - no joy. I tried removing the dForce Modifier and reapplying it and that was a dissaster. I tried the hair parented to G8F and the scalp - no joy.