Gen 8 Morph Bundle vs Parameters
ATLPR
Posts: 147
Hi All,
First, I want to mention that I appreciate DAZ soooooo much for all the great deals they are offering, that have made the creation of an animation capability much less painful to the wallet.
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May I please ask a couple morph questions.
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CONTEXT: I'm a DAZ noob (JUST STARTED THIS MONTH), and have been buying multiple items from the DAZ store so that I can create some custom animations (e.g. carrara pro, mimic pro, Face Transfer Unlimited).
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REQUIREMENT: I want to be able to manipulate the greatest number of features in Gen 8 Males and Females.
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OBSERVATIONS: While using my Gen 8 starter (e.g. Basic Gen 8 Female figure is in viewport and selected), my right-side shape tab contains nothing, but my right-side parameters tab contains PLENTY (a broad range of options)... SEE ATTACHED PIC.
=>NOTE: You can scroll through multiple params.
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ITEMS I'M LOOKING TO PURCHASE: Gen 8 head morph and body morph bundles. URL's to the ones I'm considering are below:
https://www.daz3d.com/genesis-8-female-head-morphs
https://www.daz3d.com/genesis-8-female-body-morphs
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QUESTION-1:
What is the difference between using morphs from these two packages above "genesis-8-female-head-morphs" and "genesis-8-female-body-morphs" vs. just using the parameters?
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QUESTION-2:
Is there any bundle options (what is the best way to get the most morphs)?
=>I would really love to get these two (above URL's) in a bigger bundle of 4 (Gen 8 male and female head and body morphs), but found nothing.
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INITIAL IMPRESSION: DAZ Store Package URL links above appear to offer little or no advantage over parameter adjustment (appear to offer most of the same control options). Also, I can find no bundle (e.g. Gen 8 Pro, or staff select products bundle) that contains the above morphs packages that I'm interested in.
Thank you!
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Comments
You have the head selected, not the character.
The morphs are on sale very often. Just watch out for the sales.
The two morph packages you have selected are almost essential as base morphs. Several other morph characters expect one to have those morphs to draw from, to make their character look right.
The morphs show up as parameters — you don't get them until after you buy and install the morph packs. The parameters don't exist in the base G8F/G8M figure.
You just missed it; all four of these morph sets were on sale recently in one of the big DAZ event sales (in this case, March Madness, which lasted well into this month). Shouldn't be too long before something similar happens again. They also occasionally show up in a "buy both, save $$$" deal for each figure. Put them into your wishlist, and keep an eye out for sale banners.
REPLY TO SEVRIN'S COMMENT#1:
Hi Sevrin, thank you for the response.
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Oh yes, I'm definately watching the sales... I identified high cost items (relevant to my purpose) last week that were 81% off, then applied the EXTRA-50 coupon, and recieved tremendous deals
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But back to the original inquiry, yes you are correct I selected the head to illustrate the parameters there and show that they [seem to be] comparable to what you get in these packages given in the URLs (very little added value).
=>May I pick your brain a bit further as to what are the best morph packages to buy for Gen 8 (e.g. based on your research or experience)?
REPLY TO CATHERINE3678AB'S COMMENT#1:
Ahhh thank you for educating me, that was among the many learning issues I seem to be facing (what morphs are essential to have). I will buy those morphs when they are a little less money.
Also on that point, yesterday I just learned there is such a thing as a "merchant resources" category of items here at DAZ
https://www.daz3d.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=Merchant+Resource
=>I believe these resources (including morphs) will be on my priority#1 purchase list (where relevant to my purpose).
EXAMPLE: "merchant resources" item that may be very useful...
https://www.daz3d.com/genesis-8-female-texture-merchant-resource-light-skin
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Here is a screen capture of my first face I'm working on [so far], see attached image...Notice i have a skin color issue that i have no clue how to fix [yet])... face color does not match the body.
=>I don't even know how to render yet, lol.
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BTW:
I find these forums mildly hard to navigate and learn from, for three reasons:
1. When I enter a forum keyword search it returns lots of irrelivant and old topics.
2. Thread posts are not necessarily newest first for some strange reason (e.g. look for coupons and you may get a post from 2019).
3. Comments and replies are not formatted and connected to one another for ease of reading (or is a user error / my lack of understanding the forum structure)
Thank you
REPLY TO SPOTTEDKITTY'S COMMENT#1:
Hi SpottedKitty,
Thank you for reply and for addressing the questions directly. Ah bahhoo hoo, that sucks about March madness missed sale - I'm a day late dollar short as per usual (I downloaded DAZ and installed it for the first time 4-9-2020). On that point, I think I'll hold out a little longer for another sale like you mentioned ... there actually is a march-madness-flashback going on right now (but not the right one).
https://www.daz3d.com/march-madness-flashback
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AHHH GREAT POINT RE: "buy both, save $$$"
I'm actually attempting to learn how the best value is obtained in general (e.g. bundles + coupons+ promo high %off).
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I'm also collecting keywords / search terms and URLs to determine how they arrange collections associated with sales here at DAZ...E.G.:
=>Legacy-DAZ-Originals:
https://www.daz3d.com/some-legacy-daz-originals
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=>Pre 2018 Daz Originals:
https://www.daz3d.com/pre-2018-daz-originals#
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2019 Daz Originals
https://www.daz3d.com/2019-daz-originals
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=>Daz Original Select Items
https://www.daz3d.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=DAZ+SELECT
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=>Daz Originals:
https://www.daz3d.com/daz-originals
(All typical noob activities, lol)
Thank you
The trick to searching these forums is to use Google, add Daz3d to the search parameters.
One way to have the skin textures all match in colour is to be sure to work on the entire set in the one .psd file. Worry about the details later, first just get the base skin set put together. Whatever colour shadings you do to one, do to them all, in the same session. Save out .png files and load them on the basic figure in D/S with only a basic Iray shader applied to all the skin surfaces {or whatever skin shader you'll be using, no other texture images though}. One juggles back and forth to get things right.
Once the base set is done, after saving out good back-up .png or .tiff copies for each layer, then one can work on the details - be very careful to stay away from the seams. The program I use has a limit for how heavy the project file can be so I have to delete all but the layers I'm actually working on. It is possible {because I've done it} to be working in and save a file that is too large for the program to open.
And about seams, with 3D models one does not stay inside the borders! Think of sewing and seam allowances. Some refer to those areas as buffer zones. Texture/paint colour has to be at least a few pixels outside the templates' edges.
After the diffuse/base textures are finished, then one works on making whatever other textures are required for bump, displacement, normals, etc. Looking at the surfaces of the other figures, you'll see examples of these.
Glad to help.
Wait until tomorrow, there are sometimes weekend-long special offers. If all else fails, the next big event sales are in September/October/December, but going on previous years, there's a good chance of something else cropping up long before that.
REPLY TO CATHERINE3678AB'S COMMENT#2:
I appreciate you for providing pearls of wisdom to me, and hope to use them eventually - unfortunately, I'm a fledgling at this point...(I have a learning curve to contend with). I think I will attempt to identify some of your other posts and read them to learn more.
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I see, Google search for e.g. shop hair for G8F is: genesis AND 8 "hair" site:https://www.daz3d.com/shop/
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Also, Google search for e.g. forum coupon content is: "coupon" site:https://www.daz3d.com/forums/
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HOWEVER PC+ FORUM APPEARS TO BE BLOCKED (NO GOOGLE RESULTS) E.G.: "coupon" site:https://www.daz3d.com/forums/categories/platinum-club-members-only => NADA
(probably "User-agent: * Disallow: /" for the PC forum, within the DAZ website robots.txt file)
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I just finally figure out how to identify the different categories of sales and promotions via google search:
"site:https://www.daz3d.com/shop/sales-promotions/";
(you will see results of 41 webpages [1st one is an offline derilict page])
e.g.: DAZ Originals
https://www.daz3d.com/shop/sales-promotions/daz-originals
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PRODUCT I'M PONDERING:
I was considering relying upon this product as a resource to work out some of my issues BEFORE RENDERING:
https://www.daz3d.com/reality-4-daz-studio-edition
However, this product creates two more questions in my mind:
1. Does it rely upon other plug-ins and products that I do not have (that I must also purchase)?
2. The product relies upon LuxRender, and it is unknown to me if that is now considered outdated vs. Iray?
=>Forum debate here that I'm pondering: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/56931/iray-versus-luxrender
Thank you
Reality is a whole other system. For starting out it might be time better spent learning how to use what the program already has - it has a lot!
If you're rendering portrait type scenes, this product is one of my favs:
for Iray https://www.daz3d.com/easy-portraits--light-presets
Sometimes I add a few more lights but it's a nice quick start.
REPLY TO CATHERINE3678AB'S COMMENT#3 (RE: reality and lighting):
Thank you for the lighting URL, nice price, I just collected it and am pondering it! I've actually been looking through a variety of lighting information in the last few days.
May I ask please, what is the "mother of all" lighting packages (most quantity and quality of options)?
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Touching upon a few related topics ...
In perfect candor and honesty with you, I intend to go on a free stuff hoarding spree at renderosity and other websites soon ("hoarding" - because I have no idea if I'll ever use half the stuff I may collect). The one category I found I can never have enough of was poses... the more the better. Installing the acquired items to "My Library" might be tricky (incorrect directory structures, people do not always list pre-reqs, and MALWARE).
=>I found 18 free lighting related options at renderosity (e.g. here is one search option): https://www.renderosity.com/mod/freestuff/?search=hdr
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REALITY PLUG-IN:
I actually combed through a few website 3D glossaries to sort out some of the terminology yesterday (e.g. what is Physical Based Rendering, as seen in Reality software). Side-note - I found that the Reality website is selling their product for $17 (65% off) - whereas it is $50 here at DAZ.
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MY FIRST RENDER: (lighting, Iray vs Reality, and observations etc.)
Last night after reading your previous post, I decided to do the DAZ tutorial and do my first small "Barefoot Dancer" render (Pic is attached).
=>The lighting information was inadequate in the tutorial, and I intend to sort it all out, a great deal more, in days to come.
=>The tutorial relies on the IRAY, but I left the params at 1280 x1024 (as the tutorial defaults).
RENDER RESULTS: (see image)
Not a lot of bang for the buck (my iPhone 5s pics look better than that). During render, for ~45 minutes, I monitored my server values (using portable hwmonitor free software):
=>8 Xeon Cores averaged: 4GHz, 100% utilization, Temp of 160F, and 48 Watts power consumption ...
=>Only 6 Gigs of mem (out of 16Gb DDR5) were utilized by the process
=>My wimpy 4 Gig intel GPU was not utilized during render at all (hardware was ignored by DAZ 4.12). I'm pondering that ... https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/282006/dazstudio-not-using-gpu-for-rendering
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IMPRESSIONS:
Most if the fault is with me as I stumbel my way up the learning curve.
=>LIGHTS: I'll find more lighting tutorials at youtube (lots to learn). Reality is given praise by many, but it may be old news compaired to IRAY (I have to play with it more)
=>SOFTWARE: I tend to wonder if Reality would add value by utilize my GPU, where IRAY did not (and what options I have to remedy that issue).
=>HARDWARE: I tended to wonder if I could actually burn out my hardware, (where system utilization was so extreme).
=>OPTIMIZATION: I know you must be thinking IRAY = NVIDIA ... (and I should buy a powerful RTX GRAPHICS CARD) ... I priced them, but I cannot justify that type of cost yet... besides i like the thought of using multiple devices via software, (as seen in Bryce Lightning 7) ... I have a powerful Linux server that I could (theoretically) push the heavy lifting to.
Thank you
Another source of (usually) pretty good quality freebies is sharecg. It's not always easy to find DAZ|Studio and Poser* specific files in there, though — most things I've got from there have been from links posted to the forums here.
* Note that not all Poser content will work in DAZ|Studio, although the majority will, or can be armwrestled into working. Almost all Poser poses will work, as long as you're using them on the right figure. Also, Poser content must be installed in its own Poser runtime folders, which can complicate matters. Although there are ways to convert the Poser pose files into proper D|S ones.
If you don't mind me asking examiner2, who or what inspired you to become a Daz Studio creator? And, welcome to the field!
I have often wondered the same question as you have posed.I find the morphs sometimes mix a lot of parameters into easy to use dials but many of the morphs affect the geometry in ways that the parameters do not. The geometry is a mesh and it can be deformed in unlimited ways. For instance, it is probably not possible to just use the stock parameter dials to take a Genesis 8 figure and turn them into a werewolf. This would take morphing dials instead. Many morphs use the parameter dials though not exclusively. Many morph dials are created in other programs and imported into Daz as animateable features.
Also, If you search Google with Daz Studio in the query title you will get better results in the Daz forums over the Daz forum search.
I also find the head morphs do not always work very well.
If I am going to take a figure and change their head over 50%, I am better off just loading that figure in instead. The morph geometry does not always translate well and this is where the parameters can help shave off the rough edges.
I use the head morphs to figure out which character I mostly want, then load them in and change the body to suit the head.
As for using your CPU to render. I have a 12 core 24 thread I9 CPU and I still shut that off while rendering. It is not faster than my graphics cards, not even close... and when I use it to render in Iray I cannot use my computer for much else and shutting off cores is a bother for what little it contributes. Yes, get a better graphics card, you need double the system ram for what you have in GPU ram and a better power supply forget about CPU rendering, it is a futile endeavor. Yes, not having your GPU and CPU fans on high you can burn out your hardware while rendering especially if anything is overclocked.
I think maybe you've confused yourself — "morph dials" are "parameters". Every new set of morph data installed to your base Genesis 8 figure will add a new parameter dial to that figure. The parameter dial controls the morphing of the figure mesh. They're the same thing. There's no difference between the morphs for a character you buy in the store, and morphs built in to the Genesis figure.
REPLY TO REXRED COMMENT#1 (RE: Hardware, Who, Why, DAZ):
Hi RexRed,
Thank you for the kind welcome!
Excellent hardware considerations, Geez, I had a bad feeling about that (potentially burn out device components). I looked on eBay for great deals, but RTX was all very expensive at the 16 Gig or above level, and in perfect honesty with you, I was considering various Frankenstein DIY options lol.
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I'd like to learn more about creating morph dials and importing them into DAZ, (I'm definitely adding that to my long list of things to learn)!
=>I know nothing yet, I have not had a chance to learn how the software accomplishes these morph changes (I assumed it was perhaps scaling, warping, pinching and applying other complicated filters and scripts) to the 2D counterpart (e.g. base face map).
=>I'm not sure what "loading" means, do you mean modifying heads >50% in CARRARA or Bryce, then importing figures? I own these software packages, but have not started using them yet, I've got a lot of YouTube videos to watch about them first : ) .
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RE: Why DAZ or design
Well I could take you on a wild tangent of multiple loosely related reasons for design or DAZ, but like Forest Gump, I've sort of floated around to various websites, Tripped and Fell into "DAZ world" and realized I really enjoy it. Upon introspection, I think my joy comes from the fact that I neglected the Right Half of my brain for a long time (mainly engaging in a variety of Sciences over time)...Therefore, sifting through peoples creative works/expression has been really stimulating and is motivating my creativity. I really love the outer space and dragon content. Also, I believe my activities here will take my graphic design capabilities to the next level.
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TOP 5 REALISTIC REASONS (MOTIVES):
1. RE: DAZ, it's free (no annual SaaS agreements), I'm very careful not to incur too much cost unless there is a clear purpose (e.g. enhance business capabilities). Also, DAZ seems to be top notch software so far.
2. I build websites as one source of business revenue, (typically use GIMP to enhance images), and I ALWAYS DESIRE to capture website visitor's attention with amazing Hero's and other enhanced images...basically the (business intelligence driven) necessity of utilizing increased quality and quantity of imagery was discovered after a discussion with my contact at Yelp who stated that currently 80% of website visitors prefer to see a broad range of images depicting content, (rather than lots of words). I think DAZ can help me take image quality and design to the next level.
3. I have a paralegal degree, and I'm looking to add a freelance Graphic Design (for Courtroom presentation) income stream to my business (including images, audio and short videos).
4. I've engaged in a broad range of Data Science and Mind Mapping activities for ~12 years now, and pull certain content from the internet for research purposes (utilize databases and 2D plots). I tried to use Blender for a couple of years to add a third dimension to my activities, but it was too much of a pain (time consuming). I was hopeful I could pull data into DAZ, but have barely scratched the surface.
5. I have some technology, drafting and design education and experience as well, and generally enjoy exploring and testing a variety of software (I have a large database of free software, and website building tools). On this point, I need to explore options to import, export, and convert files between various 3D software packages. One goal I'd like to accomplish is that I have large mind maps in Tuft's Visual Understanding Environment 2D, that I want to import into a 3D environment.
Thank You
Thank you for your thoughts. Yes, that makes good sense to me, but I can see why there is confusion... see attached pic (as you can see under the parameters tab, "Sabela hair" has a morph section and contains multiple dials). Therefore:
=>When I think of morph, I think of something that changes an objects shape.
=>Whereas, when I think of a parameter, I think this is the overarching big category containing all changes to an object and scene (e.g. including their XYZ position, pose, shape, rendering information).
=>Whereas, when I think of a dial, it is basically a GUI used for adjusting parameter values.
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What happens to the object, or mesh, or polygons when the parameter values change: (I have not learned that yet).
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OTHER WAYS TO MODIFY THE APPEARANCE OF THE OBJECT (OTHER THAN PARAMETERS):
This is probably elementary to you, but I learned something good today during a face transfer test (see attached image).
=>[IF] I GRAB MY BASE FACE MAP, image from the DAZ directory it belongs to (related to a scene or sub scene), open it with GIMP (or other editor), I can apply a wide variety of filters to drastically change the appearance of it (then put it back). In the attached picture, my face transfer contained a relic (a big brown spot), and to fix it, I applied the mirror-image script to it.
=>RESULT: The mirror-image script took the right side and mirrored it to the left, eliminated the brown spot and provided perfect facial symmetry.
NOTE: Of course, this is a surface change and not a shape change.
NEXT TEST: I think I will apply a pinch filter to the attached base face map and see if it causes DAZ G8F shape to change or the figure-head to compensate somehow (as an unforeseen result).
Thank you
I'm revisiting this post and comments 1 year later. This comment is still very useful. I have 24G RAM now, but no major external GPU because I discovered that my motherboard is horrible and can't support more than 400 total watts flowing through it. I now have external power supplies sitting next to my machine to power everything but the motherboard. I wanted to get a thunderbolt 3 PCIe 3.0 card and connect a docked external eGPU, but my motherboard will not support that either and no drivers available. Thank you.