How to use reflections
I've never used reflections in Daz before, unless the prop already had them as part of its settings. So, are there any simple instructions as to how to add them to objects in DS 4.0? I'm wanting to add reflections to a prop puddle, to be specific.
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Well there is more than one way to do this so here is a short list...
First off the Surface of the puddle will need to be set up to be reflective for a real reflection.
That would be setting up the surface in the Surfaces Tab for the strength, color and possible refraction of the puddle.
Then to capture the Reflection the camera angle will need to be so that a item or items reflect to the Camera to be rendered.
This also will need the render settings set to the proper Ray Trace setting to capture the reflection(s).
You can also Fake it and use a Map in the Surfaces Tab in the reflection map area and then adjust the settings in Surfaces to get the map to show as you like, this works best on content that is UV mapped and the Reflect Map is made to the Template (texture) size so it matches properly.
Cheers Jaderail.
I think, due to time and the fact that my old computer is on its last legs, my best bet is to fake it. I'm not trying for photo-realistic, just wanted to make the puddle a bit more interesting. But I will certainly mess with "proper" relections at some point.
Thanks.
EDIT: Just one more thing (he said Columbo style), what the difference between reflection and refraction?
Reflection is where the light bounces off a surface, giving you the image of what was reflected, like a mirror.
Refraction is where the light is bent as it enters a volume, such as water or glass, so that things viewed through such a medium appear distorted.
Reflection is the Surface of the item and its power to toss light back to the Eyes or in 3D the Camera.
Refraction is how light is bent when passing through different translucent items such as water and glass.
The Reflection given off from some items is effected by the refraction of the light. Probably not needed for a shallow puddle.
Thanks for clearing that up, guys.
Just tried faking it as suggested, and it gave me the image I wanted.
Thanks again.
Happy to have Helped. Enjoy yourself and render on...
Late to this today, good to hear you got what you needed.
As a note for not faking it, I noticed a graininess like the ones on shadows when the "Shadow map" is set to low. I'm still working out what actually causes that, tho it is affected by how fine the "Shading Rate" is set. Light-bounce also has an effect .
Do the "Artificial Reflections" suffer from that? The attached pic is purely "Ray-trace" on all lights, with surface reflection properties set to mimic mirrors and polished surfaces with actual refection to an extent. I'm Still very new to this. It was a 3Dlight crunch test of sorts, for this lacking computer.
Render settings for the pic from what I can remember, and notes from the test.
Bucket Size 16, MaxRayTraceDepth 5, PixelSamples (X) 4,PixelSamples (Y) 4, SadowSamples 16
Gain 1.00, Gamma Correction 'Off', Gamma 1.00
Shading Rate (per Image test, 1.00 or 2.00 from the looks of it, I don't remember for this pic)
PixelFilter 'Sinc', PixelFilterWidth (X) 6.00, PixelFilterWidth (X) 6.00
In most cases it is not just Shading Rate that applies to the image as seen here but Pixel Samples X and Y. The lower those in combo with Shading Rate the more grain you will get. For sharper images the Samples should both go up. This is also a need in DOF renders which can also suffer from grain in renders. Read the post from this link for a much better understanding
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/5084/#63872
Thank you, I had blindly set the anti aliasing "PixelSamples (X)&(Y)" out past 8 to no avail last weak. It was like anti aliasing did nothing for reflections, then I went and read up on shadows as that seamed to be similar to what I was seeing. lol.
Reading on... Thanks.
Hold that thought.... Whats that "F Stop" on the camera settings.
Is that literally the same thing as on my old 35mm Canon AE-1?
P.S. Yes the kind that takes film that gets bathed in tubs of chemicals to develop the pictures. Not the EOS-10D, lol
I read that page,
http://rubicondigital.host22.com/index.php/articles/poserdazstudio/4-optimising-render-settings-in-daz-studio
Nothing there effected the graininess of reflections, only shadows. That or I did something drastically wrong, Hmmm.
I think at some point Reflections just stop sampling. The issue might be that the image is supposed to be bounce light, and it is very possible that the Version of 3Delight we are now using in DAZ Studio just does not support higher samples at this time. I have exhausted all my tips and Ideas on it. The pixelation is not really that noticeable at larger render sizes with full high Render settings. But I agree it is not perfect in the current version of 3Delight. In my view it still goes a darn good job.
After getting a night of good sleep, and mulling over the settings I have tried and reviewing the invaluable advice from Jaderail, chohole, Sean Riesch, Richard Haseltine, Miss B, mark128, mjc1016, DestinysGarden, etc.
The clarity of a real reflection is affected by the 'Difuse' and 'Reflectivity' setting of the surface doing the reflection to an extent. However when it comes down to the limited access we have to the vast array of 3Dlight capabilities bundled with Daz Studio, we only have two basic setting that make real reflections look good.
Render Rate (with numbers smaller then 0.20), and 'Max Ray Trace Depth' of 4 minimum for skin edges in the reflection.
The more Diffuse the surface is that is reflecting, the more 'render rate' samples are needed to get an accurate per pixel result (in other wards a lower number in the 'render rate' setting box). I have seen some formulas of how this effects crunch-time, tho I have not found an actual list of 3Dlight compatible numbers for this setting beyond 2.00, 1.00, 0.50, 0.20, 0.10 and 0.01 as of this typing.
Max Ray trace depth, somehow is affected by the number of layers and other stuff that make up skin texture on figures. I assume this applies to hair as well, tho I immediately noticed the rugged outline of my render's shoulder reflections most prominently. When I set the 'Max Ray Trace Depth' to five from four, it made a small improvement for some reason I don’t fully understand.
The attached render was at 5 'Max Ray Trace Depth', and 0.10 Render Rate. Render time was 35 min 43 sec, with nothing else running on this computer.
Good work! Very well done and thanks for the extra info.
I don't get it, there seems to be some vital piece of information missing. I made a simple 2 cube scene, one scaled 200%, smaller cube in front. Set reflection on larger cube to 90%
and I see nothing. Added a spot with a cast shadow, well that works but still no reflection. Tried Diffuse at various between 40 & 99% to no avail. Also tried varios specular settings and left Refraction OFF as I don't want to bend light as in density differences above and below a plane, I want it to bounce straight off.
What am I missing here?
It may sound silly, but is the camera in a position to actually see the reflection?
That was confusing for me at first, as there is two separate reflection sliders in the surface properties tab. 'Glosiness' need not be touched, levee it at 100%, and 'Reflection Strength' further down needs to be turned up (90%).
Also, if the 'Diffuse Color' color is to bright, the reflections wont show.
P.S. Doing this on two separate comps for the rest of the month, daz Studio is on the other. Tunes and web over here, lol.
The pillar behind the figure in that pic is set to pure black on the 'Diffuse Color'.
"O", and if the 'Lighting Model' further down is set to 'Mat' or 'Skin' the reflections will be very dull if not there at all. I used 'Glossy Plastic' for my renders.
Camera was ok, I'm a hobby photographer in RL so I have a reasonable grasp of that side of it.
Glossiness wasn't touched, however I never changed default 'Plastic' mats, I also turned Diffuse down as far as 50% in various experiments. I just got a variety of white to grey faces on the front of the larger cube.
Do I need to touch camera settings?
uh, the cameras have settings? lol. I never touched the camera settings, just ray-trace shadows on All lights, and fussed with the surface settings. I also used the top-notch 3Delight render mode not the OpenGL assisted modes, I don't know if that makes a difference.
As soon as this render on the other comp is done, I'll dig up that scene, and post the actual settings of the back pillar, and them 1ft stone cubes.
O.K, back pillar and the side wall. That should help out a bit, as I was mistaken a bit earlier. Back Pillar Settings.
Side Wall Settings.
Oh that's interesting, Diffuse down to 0%. And then with but a moments thought perhaps it makes sense, if the surface cannot diffuse any light then it is left with no option but to reflect as per other settings. Is that right, he asked uncertainly.
I guess, not completely Shure my self. Tho they both Diffuse + Reflective strength add to 100%
Make sure your light is lighting areas of the cube that will show in the mirror - if they are unlit you won't see anything.
And there we have it... I never had a light at all. I was just testing after all. Now I feel really stupid. :D