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GeForce or Radeon?

mavoelkermavoelker Posts: 0
edited December 1969 in New Users

HI all,

I'm a total noob at DAZ and 3D but I've been trying it out with the free 4.6 Pro and V5 and having a great time.

A friend just gave me two graphics cards for my computer, and I don't know which is better for DAZ.

The two cards are: GeForce FX5200, and Radeon 9200SE. Both have 128MB DDR and the Radeon is "TVO" (whatever that means).

My computer is a Dell Inspiron 560, Pentium Dual-Core CPU, E5400 running at 2.70GHz, with 4.00 GB installed RAM, 64 bit machine, running Windows Home Premium 7. I've got a second monitor ready to use alongside my existing monitor.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Thank you!

Comments

  • Takeo.KenseiTakeo.Kensei Posts: 1,303
    edited December 1969

    I'm almost sure you can't plug these card as they are very old and were designed to use AGP port that I guess you don't have on your system
    I'm also not sure any of the two meets the minimal requirement for DS but if one is eventually able to, it is the Nvidia which has more feature.

    Good luck

  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited November 2013

    The GeForce is a PCI bus card. So check what your Motherboard has as standard slots. The drawback is the Open GL version 9.

    Post edited by Jaderail on
  • mavoelkermavoelker Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thank you two for answering.

    I have PCIe Gen.2 on my motherboard.

    Unfortunately, the two boards will not fit. :-(

    If you have any suggestions on a graphics card, I thank you in advance.
    My computer (vintage 2010) has two monitors because I originally had an auxiliary graphics card, but it crapped out on me about 18 months ago. So all I need is a new graphics card.

  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Simple do a Web search for GPU cards compatible with your Motherboard. Get the best you can afford.

  • mavoelkermavoelker Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thanks. After googling around, probably the Radeon HD 7750 SFF 1GB GDDR5 pcie card. $144.00.

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,249
    edited December 1969

    Many graphics cards can drive more than one monitor. Are you sure that the one card you already have cannot handle your two monitors?

  • Takeo.KenseiTakeo.Kensei Posts: 1,303
    edited November 2013

    The Dell Inspiron 560 has an old integrated Intel GMA card which uses shared memory (so it will take away some of the RAM)

    It's an old Rig, not like recent ones. So I doubt he has double output for display

    @mavoelker : the card you found should do the trick but at that price you could probably get something better like http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121651

    It's a better card with 2 Gigs Vram instead of one and has many outputs. The only thing to be aware is the type of input your monitors accept. This card has 1 x HDMI,
    1 x DisplayPort, 2 x DVI. If your monitors use VGA input you'll have to buy in addition, some DVI to VGA converters.

    On the Nvidia side you have this one http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125443

    There are a lot of choice in Newegg or Amazon (in fact everywhere). That is just a matter of knowing what to choose

    The choice of ATI or Nvidia should be done wisely with long term thinking...or not. If you plan to later use an external GPU renderer like Luxrender, ATI is a better choice. If planning to go to Octane, then you have no choice but Nvidia. If you don't plan to use GPU render then any will do

    [Edit] Little note to say that for multiple display, it is better to have more memory on the card

    Post edited by Takeo.Kensei on
  • mavoelkermavoelker Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Barbult, thank you, but Takeo.Kensei's right: I'm currently using the built in graphics capability. I used to have a graphics card, an old NVIDIA which drove both monitors. When it crapped out on me, I removed and discarded it, and plugged one of the monitors (the HDMI, not the DVI) directly into my computer's built in graphics output.

    Takeo.Kensei, that is very interesting! Have you used either LuxRender or Octane? I ask, because I have experience using BRO ASAP, an optical ray trace modeling program used in optical engineering to model light scattering in optical systems. So when I read the Wikipedia article on LuxRender, it struck a familiar chord. But Octane is also very impressive, given that one can do real-time changes. I'll have to decide which program to aim for.

  • Takeo.KenseiTakeo.Kensei Posts: 1,303
    edited November 2013

    I played a bit with the beta of octane but not that much. It is indeed impressive but Luxrender is as well even if slower. There are other renderers that are also impressive. Just have to choose. I mostly play with Blender Cycles these days which is Cuda oriented, so my next purchase will certainly be a Nvidia Card. If you plan to use other renderers than Luxrender, then the wise choice is Nvidia as you will be able to use both Cuda and OpenCL renderers even if Nvidia doesn't seem to be willing to further develop it's OpenCL capabilities . ATI's drivers is not said to be as well implemented as Nvidia's. I've only seen Luxrender that implemented a good use of OpenCL and ATI card but I didn't test any other OpenCL enabled renderer if they exist

    If you plan to render on GPU then I'd advise to spend a bit more money to get a 4Gb Vram Card as memory quantity is important in that case. I'm planning to buy the GTX 760 with 4Gb Vram for Blender Cycles and that will be usable for Luxrender or even Octane if I ever feel it. From what I've seen Octane will be easier for most users as it has a material database and with real time preview, the workflow is better. That is what you also have in Blender Cycles even if it needs polishing in some area like Tone mapping for example.
    Luxrender is good and free and has two plugin for DS so it could be a good start if you don't want to pay the price for octane yet.

    Post edited by Takeo.Kensei on
  • mavoelkermavoelker Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thanks again. So it sounds like the card you are considering, with 4GB RAM, supports both Octane and Luxrender, but is a bit more expensive. But the added expense would preserve my ability to choose either render engine. I will consider that approach.

    This is a lot of great background info and advice and I much appreciate it!! :-)

  • mybordercolliemybordercollie Posts: 1
    edited December 1969

    Uneak
    mavoelker, even though your system is PCIE 2 it may have one or two PCI slots, so you might be able to use that card you have. Also the 2 cards that Takeo.Kensei mentioned are PCIE 3 and I don't think they would work.

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,249
    edited December 2013

    PCIE 3 is backward compatible with PCIE 2. You won't get the benefits of PCIE 3 speed, but it works. I have a PCIE 3 Nvidia 760 Graphics card on my PCIE 2 bus driving 3 large monitors.

    Post edited by barbult on
  • Takeo.KenseiTakeo.Kensei Posts: 1,303
    edited December 1969

    I'll nuance one thing about the cards. Actually Nvidia pretty much limits the compute capability of it's graphic cards on the 6xx series and the 7xx series. The 5xx series were better at compute but didn't have a lot of memory. The only cards that are good at that in latest serie are the Gtx 780 and the Titan. In my situation, any card is better than my Quadro 2000m (notebook) and my 5+ years old Radeon X800XL. So I can buy any card and I'll see a big difference

    There are other considerations other than price and performance when buying a card : Sound, power consumption and how many slots the card take
    You could want something that fits only one slot, have a low power consumption and be silent. I don't know how much your Rig is occupied and if your Power Unit is sufficient. That is something you must check

    On the Nvidia side, I know Asus made a GTX 650-E card that fits one slot and only needs 75W without additional power cord to be plugged. . http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias=software&field-keywords=gtx+650-e

    There are cards that have a passive cooling system, so they will be silent but they are usually low performance card so the best choice could be to buy what you want and replace the cooling system but you'd lose your warranty I guess.

    For compatibiliyty, as Barbult said, all PCI-E 3.0 card work on PCI-E 2.0 slot. No problem with that

  • mavoelkermavoelker Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    I have 4 empty slots and 300W available for additional cards, so I think my main limitation is my computer's power supply. I asked Dell if I could replace my exiting supply with a more powerful one, and the service rep said no, that it "might hamper the other electrical components." I could not get him to tell my HOW a more powerful supply might "hamper" the other components, but he clearly did not want me to put a more powerful supply in there. My hunch, is that it's an issue of heat dissipation inside the computer case.

    So it looks like I'm power limited to any card that pulls 300W or less. I will continue to shop around.

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,249
    edited December 1969

    Here's an OT question that is bugging me. In a technical discussion like this, I bet someone has the answer. Will you forgive me for the diversion from graphics card discussions for a moment?

    When I look at this forum thread in the browser on my Samsung phone (android), my postings and some other people's are tiny, but posts from Takeo.Kensei and some other people are larger and more easily read. In Firefox on my PC, they all look the same size. I never select a size, I just let it default to whatever it likes. Are others of you selecting a larger size for each post, or is there a preference someplace that I can set for the default?

  • Takeo.KenseiTakeo.Kensei Posts: 1,303
    edited December 1969

    @mavoelker : For what I know the Dell minitower can handle standard ATX Power Unit so you can buy any PSU in the market. But I'm not sure that is what you have
    I don't think there will be any problem in changing the PSU, at least for a 550 W so I think you can do it yourself (a few screws and some precaution) provided that your Rig looks like that http://reviews.cnet.com/desktops/dell-inspiron-560-p/4505-3118_7-34837705.html

    @Barbult : I have no idea on that matter. I don't do anything special when I post. You'll have to ask DAZ Support for that I guess

  • mavoelkermavoelker Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thanks Takeo.Kensei
    That is exactly what my system is and what it looks like.
    If Nvidia says a card "requires a 550W power supply" does that mean their card draws 550W, in addition to the power the motherboard and other components use, or that a typical computer with a 550W power supply, will be able to also power that card?
    I took the side panel off the tower and took these pics:

    Dell_Inspiron_power_supply_legend.JPG
    1280 x 960 - 453K
    Dell_Inspiron_motherboard_slots.JPG
    1280 x 960 - 506K
  • Takeo.KenseiTakeo.Kensei Posts: 1,303
    edited December 2013

    You must buy a PSU according to what the whole system needs. So if the card needs 550W, you must also have some power for the rest of the system to function properly

    I've already done the calculation for you. You'll need about 350W if you go for the GTX 760. If you choose to buy a lower card you may not need to buy a new PSU

    You can check some website to calculate the power consumption like thermaltake website http://www.thermaltake.outervision.com/Power

    Post edited by Takeo.Kensei on
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