Animators, Will You Upgrade To Carrara 8.5?
Steve K
Posts: 3,235
I'm curious if Carrara 8.5, just released as a production version, offers any advantages to animation. I don't see it, unless the Genesis content is of interest (not to me).
Also, you might want to browse this thread on "10 reasons why I won’t upgrade from 8 pro to 8.5 Pro."
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/27868/
In particular, the topic of documentation comes up:
FractalDimensia: "I am surprised no one has said anything about the 8.5 documentation; or the lack thereof. Has anyone looked at the 8.5 Wiki? It must be April 1st, because it is a real joke. And their only focus is JUST on the new features/functionality. ... they just post a few lines and screenshots to their website and call it a 'guide.' "
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/27868/P30
>:(
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Comments
At this point, I have to say no. If the upgrade would have been free, yes. I had originally planned to use use several scenes in Carrara for my up and coming animation but I had so much trouble with Genesis that I gave up. I rebuilt all my scenes in Daz. I still have Carrara 8.2 and will stay with that. I would rather use the money to buy a Windows Kinect.
The prospect of new animation features was one of the main reasons I upgraded but if it weren't for 8.5's Genesis compatability I would be regretting that right now.
I'm sure other people will find a good use for the additional animation tools but I was hoping for a few changes to make animating in general simpler not to smooth out keys and place one on every frame and that sort of thing. I still need to use puppeteer if I want to place a key on the whole figure and I can't select multiple bones and place a key on them all at once (at least as far as I can tell) so I haven't felt any great improvement to my animation workflow after upgrading - it's still as cumbersome as ever.
Where to do I go to make feature suggestions for Carrara 9 because I wouldn't mind voicing a few.
Plan on 2 kinetics for decent results. Even then forget about facial gestures IMO better investment is the graph editor in the update, . Best animation is still done by manual key adjustments via graph, Fundamentally its stop frame with the aid of curve "tweens".
Plan on 2 kinetics for decent results. Even then forget about facial gestures IMO better investment is the graph editor in the update, . Best animation is still done by manual key adjustments via graph, Fundamentally its stop frame with the aid of curve "tweens".
I'd toss mine in the next yard sale.
Doesn't sound too enticing for C 8.5...
Here is a topic in the Carrara Section of the forum, "Carrara 9…DAZ, I’m begging you."
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/9583/
The latest post is over a month old, well before C 8.5, so you might want to start a new topic in the Carrara Forum, something like "OK, C 8.5 Is Here - Suggestions for C9".
Not really
When you add Genesis to a scene in Carrara it doesn't have IK so you need to set that up yourself plus the way the skeleton is displayed can make things a bit confusing, and lastly I'm not 100% certain but I think owning lots of morphs for Genesis can cause Carrara to lag when you use the figure although this could just be a result of my low end computer specs.
The main reason I'm interested in Genesis is because it's got some great monster morphs that are ideal for creating pre-rendered game sprites I don't think it brings a great deal more to the table as far as animation is concerned.
Did you note this post in that thread http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/27868/P45/#415550 and the documentation here
http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/carrara/8_5/userguide/animating/tutorials/graph_editor_box/start
Not really
When you add Genesis to a scene in Carrara it doesn't have IK so you need to set that up yourself plus the way the skeleton is displayed can make things a bit confusing, and lastly I'm not 100% certain but I think owning lots of morphs for Genesis can cause Carrara to lag when you use the figure although this could just be a result of my low end computer specs.
The main reason I'm interested in Genesis is because it's got some great monster morphs that are ideal for creating pre-rendered game sprites I don't think it brings a great deal more to the table as far as animation is concerned.
OK, thanks. Your interest is a pretty narrow one, but I'm glad it offers you what you need. For the rest of us, Genesis does not sound like much of a plus. I'm still sticking with my vast collection of Gen 4 content. It ain't broke, so why fix it?
Did you note this post in that thread http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/27868/P45/#415550 and the documentation here
http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/carrara/8_5/userguide/animating/tutorials/graph_editor_box/start
Yes, that does look like an improvement, thanks. I use the graph editor a lot, so I'll give it a try. For this feature, the documentation does look pretty good, although I have not yet tried it.
To balance out the story, here is some discussion on why some people will upgrade to Carrara 8.5:
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/27970/
I have no problem with most of the points discussed. I have enjoyed using Carrara ever since the direct loading and seamless integration with Poser content was added. I have more than a dozen animations on YouTube, many done for the 48 Hour Film contest, and probably 90+% of the total video footage done in Carrara. I also have Lightwave, Poser, Bryce, Vue Complete and other programs, but I use them only when I can't do it in Carrara, e.g. a nice Vue landscape (even then, I always consider a Howie Farkes Carrara landscape).
I am still on the fence about C 8.5, since I don't see the included Genesis content as an attraction. As some have mentioned, it would be nice if DAZ offered the upgrade at a lower price without the Genesis stuff. Even better, drop the Genesis content and add complete, comprehensive documentation for Carrara (the last was for V.7 - I may have mentioned this before), and keep the price the same.
Since neither of those is likely to happen, I may have to hold my nose and fork over the $$ ...
:shut:
I'm buying 8.5 as soon as a check arrives next week. The animation filters clinched it for me. Messiah has had something similar for a while. It's great for cleaning up mo cap files and may be for Puppeteer files, too. I've been doing Genesis stuff in Studio, but it will be nice to have it in Carrara.
I haven't used Puppeteer a lot in Carrara, but I think it's possible to get some of the same functionality it has in Studio by using the animation tools already in Carrara. And here's a different way to use it... kind of like a test pad and then you put the keyframes where you want, when you want. The video is in French, but you can figure out what to do by watching. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcNE7dvUK6s
I upgraded gladly, not so much for the content but for the few overall improvements. I love Carrara, am well aware of its limitations on Animation. IK doesn't work well with v4, sometimes target helpers assist but I have created a run cycle strictly with FK (took a while). Still, the fact that I have characters I've spent years playing with already rigged and morphed, it is a fair trade off compared to having to either create my own mesh or rig V4 in LW or Blender or another package..
Love to have it be Lightwave as far as some of the options and complexity, but I am finding it tough to do the technical aspects of rigging and as much as I really do love Lightwave, I feel very comfortable in Carrara, and I like my overall renders in it.. So I am creating my animation short in it. Really, this is just a hobby, for fun, and the only pipeline I need to fit in it my own.
I think the fact that Carrara can be fairly deep, but I can also get buy with just a handful of tools as well depending on the project is a great advantage. I do work to learn Lightwave, but the more tend to learn, the better my work in Carrara becomes. Anyway, it is a good tool and a fair price (given to move from LW 10 to 11.6 is $695) the $100 for the 8.5 isn't bad. It is my hobby, I enjoy it. I guess if I were to work on becoming a professional at it, I would work ardently to develop my Lightwave or other more mainstream software, but my own vision is the only one I am working on so, for the present Carrara works fine.
Oh,Yes, love to see more Animation functionality added, like decent V4 or even Genesis IK so I can actually save time in my animating. But it is a trade off.
I bought 8.5 for the Genesis bundles which were thrown in (had resisted to date), plus I do a lot of tutorials so wanted to stay up to date.
However as regards animating (and upgrading), the golden rule as far as I'm concerned is that you can't upgrade in the middle of a project.
For that reason (compatibility, and yes I saw that 8.5 made a mess of my 8.1 lighting rig) I'm sticking with 8.1 for the next 2 episodes of my animated series at least. (til the end of the year).
I've been animating with Carrara for 2.5 years now and it's such a vast learning curve, I'm still learning new things now and again (or realising better ways of doing things).
I think it's a great animator, but then again I've only got Daz 3 advanced and Bryce 7 to compare against.
Right, the wing walkers' motto, "Never let go of anything til you've got hold of something else."
I still have not upgraded, since the Genesis content doesn't interest me. C 8.1 has more features than I can get my head around already. I've used Lightwave, Poser, Vue, Bryce ... none come close to C 8.1 except Vue for certain purposes (landscapes and some Vue content I really like). Plus C 8.1 has gotten to be second nature for most animation tasks, so if it ain't broke ...
One of the main reasons I upgraded to 8.5 was for the better FBX support. This helped me when exporting from Carrara to other apps (Lightwave, iClone, etc.) as well as when importing from other apps to Carrara (i.e. iClone to Carrara).
would be very nice if there were a demo for 8.5 !
i would like to see if the animationworkflow is really better than
animate 2 in dazstudio 4.6 with graphmate amd aniblocks
I import from iClone to Carrara, and I must say that the FBX import works, but you have to work at it --considerably.
Not forgetting the new tools for zero / memorise / restoring poses found in the Animation Toolbar menu ( think a figure has to be selected before it shows )
I find these very useful.
Animators - dont forget to visit CarraraTors
http://bond3d.wix.com/carrarators