Data Folder Confusion
nohshow
Posts: 6
Hi,
Long-time infrequent user here, now working on a series of animations for Public Consumption on You Tube and the like.
When I started IN 2004-ish (D|S 2) I realised I'd need a better way to keep track of the thousands of assets I'd downloaded or bought so I separated each character into his or her own folder into which their clothes, props etc would (generally) also be placed. I also separated out props, interior and exterior locations, transport, hair, poses etc which could be used with any character. Recently I've made specific prop and environment folders for each video where tracking specific items down might become time-costly (a particular top hat, the best whip, preferred animals etc - it's a Circus video
).
Also, because of fragmentation issues, I keep my C drive as small as possible and use a 1TB V drive for my video an 3D work.
So, so far so good. And reasonably functional, you'll be surprised to hear.
Over the course of years, and on many different replacement computers and motherboards, I've created what I consider a Casting Pool of characters, variations of the Daz originals that I like the look of and tend to re-use in scenes and storylines as appropriate. Last year I created a 3D Beatles band in D|S, for example - if I remember I'll link you to the You Tube upload. I tend to create characters in D|S 2.3 as I'm perfectly happy, and am almost exclusively accessorised, with everything up to M4 and V4.2. Also, animation in D|S 4 is a nightmare, while D|S 2 has the irreplacable Animator prog. I reserve D|S 4 for rendering on my super-fast supercomputer.
I'm now getting to the point, a big clue to which is in that last sentence:
I use three computers for any given task. The slowest is for synching sound and creating music. The next slowest is my workaday machine. It's runs Daz Studio very smoothly and, though even test rendering can take lengthy minutes, it loads and saves quickly enough, even when running multiple copies of Daz. It can't handle large content, of course, but that isn't its job. Both these machines are still XP because I'm not an idiot. Or rather, I'm not smart enough to completely migrate to Linux.
The fastest machine runs Windows 8 and has a graphics card that will handle everything I've thus far thrown at it. Rendering time is now days rather than weeks for a given scene.
To keep this mini-farm functioning, I have chosen to install D|S 2 and 4.9 on each machine. I use one location to store all of the work I create, divided into folders for each project, and have one DATA folder for all of the saved scene data which is duplicated in the same relative location on each machine. They are clones of each other in that each iteration of Daz utilises the same (relative to each machine) Content tree. There should be no difference in how each seeks the same data.
And yet there is.
I have wasted more time trying to find where Daz thinks a data file should be than is practical in a normal daily workflow. I have read log files that say it's looking in precisely the right place, assuming it has its starting point right. I find lines like, "Unable to find file for storable: SCENES/data/M3-FormalPack_Jacket_7370/hip/modifiers/morphs/rOpen_204.dsd" wholly perplexing as it seems to have everything right except it doesn't feel like divulging what drive it's looking on or what directory on that drive. I have to assume it's the V drive as, as I've said, that's the only one I use for this work, but where is it going from there? I have opened my SCENES/data" folder and I can find "M3-FormalPack_Jacket_7370/hip..." etc, so why can't Daz? It's right there in exactly the place it says it can't find it. And, yes, Daz/Content/Scenes is one of the Daz directories I have made available in the Content preferences.
Please, if anyone knows what's going on here and how to deal with it, I will be grateful. I'll make you the fifth Beatle.
Which reminds me:
Regards,
Stephen
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Comments
I suspect you may have had both Scenes and the folder that contained Scenes set as content diectories on the machine you used for saving the file, and DS used the folder that contained Scenes as the root of the path (so it stored it as quoted - SCENES/data/M3-FormalPack_Jacket_7370/hip/modifiers/morphs/rOpen_204.dsd. If your other machine (correctly) has the Scenes folder set as a content directory but not the folder that contaisn the Scenes folder then DS won't be able to find the files (because it's looking for SCENES/data/M3-FormalPack_Jacket_7370/hip/modifiers/morphs/rOpen_204.dsd in each of your content directories). One fix, if that is the case, would be to add a Scenes folder to your content dierctory and to place a copy of the Data directory in that.
Thank you for your reply, Richard.
You've highlighted a possibility that at some stage in the process of trying to streamline things I may have made several blunders. So what would the preferred method be? My goal is to make it so that there is only one Data folder that Daz ever needs to access and, if possible, with no duplication so as to save space.
I hope you can help as I'm becoming a little distraut at this stage.
S
.daz files are not readily, if at all, editable so fixing the bad paths (if that is indeed the issue) would be tricky. You could try loading on the original machine, with the wrong folder selected, then remove the wrong folder and save as a scene - I think that would correct the paths, but it's obviously a huge chore.
Very true, while .daz files can be opened in Notepad and, to some extent, read, what I take to be the ASCII has spaces between each character and invisible doesn't necessarily mean unoccupied when it comes to reading spaces. Otherwise, a quick and simple Search And Destroy function on every iteration of "SCENES" might just be all that's needed. However and whatever....
That aside, I've managed to spend the day playing with everything I can to see what works and here's a summary of what I've found - not that it's a solution....
The Directory Tree on the older, slower machine (Volvo, where a number of older files were made) is in all respects the same as on the new, swifter one (Dark Knight) with one exception: Volvo has an extra Poser Directory called [ProgRoot]:/Content
When I add [ProgRoot]:/Content to Dark Knight's tree it makes no significant difference and I tacitly rule it out for now.
My Daz Directory Tree has four locations: [ProgRoot]:/Content for immovable textures etc; [ProgRoot]:/Scripts which, thinking about it now, could be a major part of the problem; [ScenesRoot]:/Content/SCENES which is how I get to see my .daz files, and [ScenesRoot]:/Content to catch any strays and hastily saved and unattributed creations, of which there used to be a lot more than there are now.
This has led to four currently active Data folders on Dark Knight. The one that's most used is [ScenesRoot]:/Content/SCENES/Data and its companion, [ScenesRoot]:/Content/Data. A third, which could be an error and that will have to be fixed, is [ProgRoot]:/Scripts/data. The fourth I created today following your advice and is [ProgRoot]:/Scenes /Data
When I copy the missing data shown in the log file from Scripts/Data to Scenes/Data, many of my older files now work. Thank you again - fifth Beatle status very nearly assured (if only your name weren't Richard, they already have one of those, could get confusing...) However there are still some recidivists from a similar era, involving a David (D3) figure in particular, that haven't responded to the same treatment.
The slow machine is being particularly slow tonight but so far has managed to load, almost without error, everything that was written there. I'll just repeat, the Content trees on each of these machines, running precisely similar versions of Daz, are currently precisely the same. Data files have been copied from one machine to the equivalent location on the other and still some tinkering is required on the second machine to get things to load properly.
Ah, the speed issue on Volvo has just revealed itself - the HD has just displayed an intermittent fault - time for a back-up, methinks...
"You could try loading on the original machine, with the wrong folder selected, then remove the wrong folder and save as a scene - I think that would correct the paths, but it's obviously a huge chore."
Might even be quicker to make new scenes
Neither prospect is entirely appealing but, conversely, if your suggested huge chore is successful it'll simplify matters in the future. Well worth investigation. I'll be back when I have news.
S
What OS's do you have on each machine? If by [ProgRoot] you mean the application folder, and it's the Windows default "Program Files" or "Program Files (x86)", Windows XP allowed applications to do things in that directory which later versions of Windows do not.
Edit: I see you did say in your first post that the slower machine is XP and the fast one is Windows 8.
Hi, Fixmypcmike, and thank you for joining in. Lovin' the avatar
.
Yes, that's pretty much the set-up (by [ProgRoot] I mean the application folder), though I don't use the default path as it can become fragmented, sluggish and full very quickly.
My "ProgRoot" Application starting point is the V: drive.
When I started all this in around 2004/5, the biggest drive anyone thought you'd ever need was 40GB and only us "artists" figured that 80GB would be a better option, and given that my current DAZ Studio HD is 1TB of which almost 700GB have already been filled with programs, files and assets including Hexagon, Carrara, Bryce, Make Human and Blender, and given also that I still need a further 500GB HD to edit the movies I'm making, the HD on which the C drive currently resides (I think it's of the order of 100GB) would be woefully inadequate to my needs.
One slight correction, though, if it doesn't sound too precious: The slowest and the faster machines are both running 32-bit XP. The very fast one is a 64-bit W8 machine which I use almost exclusively for rendering with D|S 4.9. My last comments were related to the slow and medium-speed XP machines.
S
Erratum
I said earlier that what "could be an error ... that will have to be fixed, is [ProgRoot]:/Scripts/...", but in fact this was not an error. In order to access scripts, it is, in fact, essential, in fact, to include Scripts in the Daz Directories list ... in fact. D'oh!
FOLLOWUP:
Testing Richard's idea of "loading on the original machine, with the wrong folder selected, then remove the wrong folder and save as a scene", I'm prepared to issue an early report of seeming success in this area.
As it turns out, by deleting everything from the Directories lists that isn't essential, which in theory could be almost everything but reinstating them all would take farrrr too long, and saving again, then re-loading with this minimalist set-up the same file, everything looks absolutely fine.
What this means is that, yes, it should in fact be possible to gather all data files in one folder provided you remember to clear the Daz Directories list of all but the location you wish to use before saving. However, it would seem to be obviously vital to remember to reinstate them all (which usually won't be many) before trying to load an older file that wasn't saved in this manner. It may even mean adding directories and folders that you only need for one or two files, though determining which these are will be a matter of trial, error, guess-work and labour.
The upside of the upshot is that my goal (to collect all data files in one folder for easier transfer to other machines) should be entirely achievable.
I'll keep you posted...
S
Very briefly, an update on my findings so far.
It appears well nigh impossible to tinker significantly with old files directly. Editing them is a nightmare wrapped in a mare's nest inside a delusion. The best you can do in order to load anything from your earliest to your latest is to guess and create a Data folder in as many locations as you can think of and populate those folders with as much data as the file requires. Set your Daz Content Directory appropriately. Doesn't matter how many paths you give it at this point, you'll be getting rid of the excess later. Pointers will come from the log file you create each time you attempt to load another file.
This can take a while since each time you load the file and check the results in its log file it can lead you down another path of ancient paths. However, you're all a lot smarter than me and didn't try being too clever for your own good at the outset, so you'll probably find this a quicker job than I have so far.
Once the file is successfully loaded, or sufficiently so to get you started, change your preferences to what you want them to be, and here you might even be tempted to use a whole new partition, which can be accessed via a home or internal network, for your new Data folder. In my case I have only one location specified for this stage of the operation (recommended). Now save your file with a new name. You can delete the old one later when you're satisfied this has all worked. Reason: It appears that if you use the same name, Daz retains old data in the .daz file. I haven't thoroughly tested this but I've seen it in two files for sure and possibly others, now. I'll figure that out later and let you know. In any event, no harm separating the old from the new before risking the loss of originals.
For a best-test, power everything down and try to load the new file with only the single, preferred Data path in the Daz Content preferences. It should work, it has for me, so far.
Foreseeable issues: I also need, and you probably do, too, a Daz Directory route to my Scripts folder. Does this risk the program using this path at some stage in the future if, as I intend, it will be the second of two paths in my preferences?
Two ways of dealing with this and the first is currently mere conjecture. Let's get it out of the way, then. Daz seems to follow the first path it encounters when saving, so I keep my preferred Data folder path at the top of the list. This ought to make it unlikely that it will want to use the second (scripts).
Second option might actually be more elegant and that's to put my scripts into the same location as my data folder. I tend to scavange new scripts from time to time, anyway, and updating three PCs, while not exactly an arduous task, may be forestalled if I do this and use a Network path for each computer, laptop or tablet (?). Now one ought even to be able to work away from home using an internet path to your storage.
I haven't tested the networking idea yet so I'm just crossing a couple of fingers about that for now. In any event, putting your scripts in the new Data path in a clean partition seems a valid and intriguing idea.
Now, I'm quite aware that I may be the only creature on your planet who has these issues, but if there's the slightest chance I'm not and assuming we're all equally innocent of the inner workings of Daz Studio, hopefully this and the comments of contributors elsewhere on this page will assist you as you work to overcome your information shortfall.
Anyway, that's all I've come up with so far. More updates as and if I find out new stuff,
So far, the Fifth Beatle position is Richard's. I'll get to that next...
S
It does matter how many paths you give it if those paths are nested. For example you cant have both Z:/My 3D Content and Z:/My 3D Content/My DAZ Library as the second path would be nested in the first.
Hi, Jestmart, thanks for joining in.
Your point is valid as far as it goes, though I'm not sure it's exactly what I've been finding. On the other hand I have just found something new that threatens to upset everything else I've learned so far.
A file that has refused to load even though it appears to be using the correct Data path has just loaded for the first time since it was made. I achieved this by ignoring common sense and copying an old data folder for David (blDavid_72712) over the new one. All I can guess is that there was a manipulation, morph or movement in the old file that wasn't in the new one but I doubt that's the complete answer. But it does raise a nasty question: Am I going to archive all the data folders forever? Cos that would swallow up a veritable shipload of storage on my HDD.
Now as to whether the "nesting" notion has wings or not (see what I did there?
), while that might simplify the loading of certain older files, my current purpose is not so much to have a way of finding missing data folders, though that has been and may continue to be a major concern (as with that old David file), as to have a way to limit the numbers of places Daz Studio will try to write a new data folder.
So far my latest approach (and again, my thanks to Richard Haseltine for pointing me in this direction) of "Load with as many Data Folders linked in the Daz Directories preferences as you can find on your system; Save with just one" has been meeting with some success .
To the extent that I'm now wondering if I might save some time in the future by creating a new Data folder for each extended project (usually months when it comes to animation, and years in one case that I still haven't finished yet) and collect them together into one location at the completion of the project for archive, recovery and correction purposes. I'm mulling the complications of that one as I continue working on the current project. It might be too late to test this theory on it just yet.
Thanks to all who have contributed here. Updates as, when and if....
S
Studio only wrote data files when a scene had items that needed to be converted to Studio's format or when saving figure, prop or morph assets. Studio still writes files to data for converted Poser and other non Studio format item but it now puts them in an "auto_adapted" sub folder of the data folder of the Studio format library you are saving to. To be able to archive future scene's asset it would be best to create a new project library for the scene.
That's very true and I appreciate the detail, it will come in handy as I proceed.
At the moment, as I'm still using Daz 2.3 as my preferred medium for creating figures and adapting old ones, the legacy method of Daz creating data folders seemingly at random - though I've managed to make considerable headway in determining the logic behind this apparent whimsey - is the focus of my attention at the moment.
Not that I necessarily disparage 4.9+ but the animation tools available to me are all limited to 2.3 and 3.0. This is likely due to my lapsing as a Platinum member when I lost my job a few years ago. I dread to think how much I spent over the years in mere cash terms though I'm quite content with the assets I'd managed to amass before the belt tightened. I do still depend on 4.9 for finalising and rendering my animations on a 64 bit machine (is lip synch still unavailable to 64 bit 4.9 users??) as it reduces the rendering time significantly.
S