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Does any Artist had trouble with commercial use of DAZ Studio Render?

R25SR25S Posts: 595
edited December 1969 in New Users

Does any Artist have trouble selling their Art (rendered only with products from the DAZ Store) because the Company to whom you sell say you are not the creator of that art or the owner of the figure shown on your Art (because they have seen it somewhere on an Website - maybe at DAZ) and theirfore have no right to sell it; even if you show them the EULA wich proves you have the right to sell your rendered Image?

Comments

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    edited December 1969

    Sounds like it's time to business elsewhere and/or talk to a lawyer.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    It is not worth the effort to go to lawyer. Because it is not my main job.
    I wanted to make some money by selling some Shirts, Mugs and so on with som Art I made from DAZ Content. I would sell this in a sub-shop from a big-shop wich does all the selling, I only had to design the Shirts and so and they sell it and I got some Money for each thing with my design they sell.
    First they wanted to see a Lizenz wich proves that I have the right to sell this Art and I send them the EULA from DAZ.
    After two days they tell me that they see pictures with similar looking content in the web and so they don`t belive that I am truly the owner of this art and have the right to use it commercial... and so they won`t sell them.

    I told them they should ask DAZ Inc. if they don`t belive me and what the EULA said.

    For only a hand full of bucks (I don`t belive that I can earn more than 15 buck in a month with this shop) it is not worth go to lawyer and at a court.

    I only want to see if some other Artist encountered such Problems and how do they solve it.

  • KhoryKhory Posts: 3,854
    edited December 1969

    Do they already have anything else on the site that looks like the same models etc were used? If so you might try calling them on that. Or offer to send them images of your receipts for the products. It is pretty clear they don't have a good grasp about terms of use in this case. Or it could be that they may have been burned in the past. I know this sounds unbelievable, but there really are people out there who are perfectly happy to sell images done with pirated products or to sell the work of someone else that they have appropriated.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited May 2015

    No, they dont have items with pictures like the one I like to sell.
    But they have some items (inside sub-Shops) with pictures from Renderosity content; I`m sure about the content because I have this content from Rendersosity in Runtime - and since it is an obj (with no moving parts) it it clearly to identify.
    And they also have some shirts (in sub-shop) wich definitly are from known Artist (because I see them in some Artbook) and not been designed by the shop-owner

    The only receipts for products they have is, that you mast have the right to use it commercial and/or have created it by your own; and you`are not allowed to use photos, you are only allowed to use Grafics of all kind.


    Edit:
    If you look at the screenshot; this Shirts are made with content from the Vendor Poison sold on Renderosity and those content can be seen on the web very often.

    lizenz.jpg
    936 x 954 - 78K
    Post edited by R25S on
  • KhoryKhory Posts: 3,854
    edited December 1969

    You could call them on being a bit uneven with acceptance then. Or look for a different outlet (unless the sales numbers there are just that much better than any other place would be).

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    If they don`t accept the EULA, in the second atempt, I tell them about some products wich depends on the same or nearly the same EULA and ask them why this can be sold and mine not.

    Unfortunately it is not very easy to find a webshop wich offers you the ability to sell your own designs on a provision base.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    Now I know where the true problem lie...
    they don`t understand what the EULA means... they don`t see the difference between my rights on my rendered image and the product wich I use for render.
    They read that I don`t have the right to sell the product (the content I bought in DAZ store) in whole or in part and thought that I don`t have rights on the rendered Image...
    Now I told them that those are two different things... and I`m not going to sell the content but only my own rendered work.
    After this clearance they are going to accept the EULA.

  • Steven-VSteven-V Posts: 727
    edited December 1969

    I know this episode was annoying to you, but I think the company did the right thing. They misunderstood the EULA, but they were protecting the rights of the original artists. I can't fault them for that.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    I`m not really blaming them for not understanding the EULA (had Problems with this, too... bacause english is not my native language) but I ask about what I can do and what I can`t do.

    I blaming them because the first thing they say was that I didn`t create the picture and I only do copy it somewhere else in the web... and this is some kind of defamation...

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    edited December 1969

    steven.viscido said:
    I know this episode was annoying to you, but I think the company did the right thing. They misunderstood the EULA, but they were protecting the rights of the original artists. I can't fault them for that.

    I can blame them...

    It states rather clearly right in the EULA that it is allowed.

    Terms of Use. Two Dimensional Works. Subject to the terms and conditions of this Agreement, User may (i) access, use, copy and modify the Content in the creation and presentation of two-dimensional animations and renderings, (ii) incorporate two dimensional images (including two dimensional images that simulate motion of three dimensional objects) derived by User from the Content in User’s other works, and (iii) publish, market, distribute, transfer, sell or sublicense User’s two-dimensional animations, renderings and other works; provided that User may not in any case publish, market, distribute, transfer, sell or sublicense any renderings, animations, software applications, data or any other product from which any Content, or any part thereof, or any substantially similar version of the Content can be separately exported, extracted or de-compiled into any re-distributable form or format.

    They simply didn't read the whole thing. It's not about 'protecting' anything...it's the webshop being too lazy.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    I think they read the whole thing... but they don`t understand...
    because they refer to
    "User may not in any case publish, market, distribute, transfer, sell or sublicense any renderings, animations, software applications,
    data or any other product..."
    but they dont understand that this only is relevant for "...from which any Content, or any part thereof, or any substantially similar version of the Content can be separately exported, extracted or decompiled into any re-distributable form or format."
    and this because they don`t know what`s the difference between the Content (the Product from the DAZ Store) and the rendered picture I create.
    This may occure because they also not native english speaking and don`t have any idea of DAZ Studio or similar program and 3D Content.

    For an example... you may know the Renderosity EULA (I send them, too), wich say nearly the same as the DAZ EULA, is beginning withe words "STANDARD END USER LICENSE AGREEMENT FOR RENDEROSITY MARKETPLACE PRODUCTS"
    Do you know what they say about this?
    They say that this License is for Marketplace`s only and they are no Marketplace!
    If I read this Statement I thought "are you kidding or what?
    This makes clear to me that they don`t really understand a single word of the EULA.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    ....next round...

    Now; they agree that I have the rights on my rendered Images but they say that I can`t sell them at their shop because I don`t have the right to sublicens it.... even DAZ EULA clearly state that I have the right to sublicense...

    "...publish, market, distribute, transfer, sell or sublicense User’s two-dimensional animations, renderings and other works..."

    This turn out to become an neverending story.

    Now; I write to DAZ Support and ask them if they can give me something other then the EULA to prove that I can sell and sublicense my renders... (I don`t think so...)

  • BeeMKayBeeMKay Posts: 7,019
    edited December 1969

    Wow... one would think that native English speakers understand an English EULA if you textmark it for them... but hopefully, DAZ CS will put together something that will make them get their head out of the WC.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    lee_lhs said:
    Wow... one would think that native English speakers understand an English EULA if you textmark it for them... but hopefully, DAZ CS will put together something that will make them get their head out of the WC.

    you misunderstand; they are not native english speaking (Germany)

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 102,770
    edited December 1969

    R25S said:
    lee_lhs said:
    Wow... one would think that native English speakers understand an English EULA if you textmark it for them... but hopefully, DAZ CS will put together something that will make them get their head out of the WC.

    you misunderstand; they are not native english speaking (Germany)

    You could suggest they open a Zendesk support ticket for Copyright Abuse to ask for clarification on the EULA.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    Richard Haseltine said:
    R25S said:
    lee_lhs said:
    Wow... one would think that native English speakers understand an English EULA if you textmark it for them... but hopefully, DAZ CS will put together something that will make them get their head out of the WC.

    you misunderstand; they are not native english speaking (Germany)

    You could suggest they open a Zendesk support ticket for Copyright Abuse to ask for clarification on the EULA.


    I ask them to do so but they told me they are not in the position to ask someone or a company about their license and that I have to clear all questions about any license.

    But I don`t know what else I should send them other then the EULA. They say that I have to send them a true-license or a resell-license or a license that give me the right to give them a sublicense.
    I think everything they want is clearly stated in the DAZ EULA...

  • BeeMKayBeeMKay Posts: 7,019
    edited December 1969

    Die einzige Möglichkeit auf Nummer Sicher zu gehen, wäre, die EULA beglaubigt übersetzen zu lassen. Aber das kostet natürlich.
    Du könntest mal im deutschsprachigen Teil des Forums nachfragen (http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/35102/ ), ob eventuell jemand dort so ein Problem schon mal gehabt hat, und welche Erfahrungen es gibt.

    Ich habe die Befürchtung, das die Eumels im Laden nicht wirklich gut Englisch sprechen, aber das nicht zugeben wollen. Dann nützt auch ein Schreiben von DAZ nichts, weil sie es ebensowenig verstehen werden, wie die EULA.

    (Sorry for the German language. I just pointed out that the best option would be to have a certified translation of the EULA done by a pro translator, but that is rather costy.)

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    lee_lhs said:
    Die einzige Möglichkeit auf Nummer Sicher zu gehen, wäre, die EULA beglaubigt übersetzen zu lassen. Aber das kostet natürlich.
    Du könntest mal im deutschsprachigen Teil des Forums nachfragen (http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/35102/ ), ob eventuell jemand dort so ein Problem schon mal gehabt hat, und welche Erfahrungen es gibt.

    Ich habe die Befürchtung, das die Eumels im Laden nicht wirklich gut Englisch sprechen, aber das nicht zugeben wollen. Dann nützt auch ein Schreiben von DAZ nichts, weil sie es ebensowenig verstehen werden, wie die EULA.

    (Sorry for the German language. I just pointed out that the best option would be to have a certified translation of the EULA done by a pro translator, but that is rather costy.)


    I don`t think they would accept a translation of the EULA.
    I think the main problem is that they don`t accept the EULA itself... because they say that the DAZ EULA is not a true license.

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 33,604
    edited December 1969

    R25S said:
    lee_lhs said:
    Die einzige Möglichkeit auf Nummer Sicher zu gehen, wäre, die EULA beglaubigt übersetzen zu lassen. Aber das kostet natürlich.
    Du könntest mal im deutschsprachigen Teil des Forums nachfragen (http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/35102/ ), ob eventuell jemand dort so ein Problem schon mal gehabt hat, und welche Erfahrungen es gibt.

    Ich habe die Befürchtung, das die Eumels im Laden nicht wirklich gut Englisch sprechen, aber das nicht zugeben wollen. Dann nützt auch ein Schreiben von DAZ nichts, weil sie es ebensowenig verstehen werden, wie die EULA.

    (Sorry for the German language. I just pointed out that the best option would be to have a certified translation of the EULA done by a pro translator, but that is rather costy.)


    I don`t think they would accept a translation of the EULA.
    I think the main problem is that they don`t accept the EULA itself... because they say that the DAZ EULA is not a true license.

    How much clearer do you have to be. It says it is the End User License Agreement at the top of the page. http://www.daz3d.com/eula

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    chohole said:
    R25S said:
    lee_lhs said:
    Die einzige Möglichkeit auf Nummer Sicher zu gehen, wäre, die EULA beglaubigt übersetzen zu lassen. Aber das kostet natürlich.
    Du könntest mal im deutschsprachigen Teil des Forums nachfragen (http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/35102/ ), ob eventuell jemand dort so ein Problem schon mal gehabt hat, und welche Erfahrungen es gibt.

    Ich habe die Befürchtung, das die Eumels im Laden nicht wirklich gut Englisch sprechen, aber das nicht zugeben wollen. Dann nützt auch ein Schreiben von DAZ nichts, weil sie es ebensowenig verstehen werden, wie die EULA.

    (Sorry for the German language. I just pointed out that the best option would be to have a certified translation of the EULA done by a pro translator, but that is rather costy.)


    I don`t think they would accept a translation of the EULA.
    I think the main problem is that they don`t accept the EULA itself... because they say that the DAZ EULA is not a true license.

    How much clearer do you have to be. It says it is the End User License Agreement at the top of the page. http://www.daz3d.com/eula

    yes, chohole... that`s the question... I don`t know what other then the DAZ EULA I could send them... you can`t make it any clearer.

    I think the problem is... they are to stupid to understand...

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 33,604
    edited December 1969

    R25S said:
    chohole said:
    R25S said:
    lee_lhs said:
    Die einzige Möglichkeit auf Nummer Sicher zu gehen, wäre, die EULA beglaubigt übersetzen zu lassen. Aber das kostet natürlich.
    Du könntest mal im deutschsprachigen Teil des Forums nachfragen (http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/35102/ ), ob eventuell jemand dort so ein Problem schon mal gehabt hat, und welche Erfahrungen es gibt.

    Ich habe die Befürchtung, das die Eumels im Laden nicht wirklich gut Englisch sprechen, aber das nicht zugeben wollen. Dann nützt auch ein Schreiben von DAZ nichts, weil sie es ebensowenig verstehen werden, wie die EULA.

    (Sorry for the German language. I just pointed out that the best option would be to have a certified translation of the EULA done by a pro translator, but that is rather costy.)


    I don`t think they would accept a translation of the EULA.
    I think the main problem is that they don`t accept the EULA itself... because they say that the DAZ EULA is not a true license.

    How much clearer do you have to be. It says it is the End User License Agreement at the top of the page. http://www.daz3d.com/eula

    yes, chohole... that`s the question... I don`t know what other then the DAZ EULA I could send them... you can`t make it any clearer.

    I think the problem is... they are to stupid to understand...

    Personally I would give up with them and move to a different site which provides the same service.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    If I don`t get any results in the next few days I will give up.
    The problem is their are 2 or 3 Shops wich provide the ability to have a sub-shop on their Webstore and do all the work for you and then give you some money whenever some your design is sold... and they all say the same about the EULA.

    I thought about selling at Deviant Art but they are not placed in my Country so I don`t know if this will be a good thing...

  • FishtalesFishtales Posts: 6,162
    edited December 1969

    If it is t-shirts you want to sell then you could set up your own shop with this company.

    http://www.spreadshirt.com/open-free-tshirt-shop-C3600

    or this one that does various options.

    http://www.zazzle.co.uk/sell/designers

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited December 1969

    Fishtales said:
    If it is t-shirts you want to sell then you could set up your own shop with this company.

    http://www.spreadshirt.com/open-free-tshirt-shop-C3600

    or this one that does various options.

    http://www.zazzle.co.uk/sell/designers


    :-)) Sorry for the laughing... but Spreadshirt actaully is the company wich causes the problem.

  • R25SR25S Posts: 595
    edited May 2015

    Fishtales said:
    If it is t-shirts you want to sell then you could set up your own shop with this company.

    http://www.spreadshirt.com/open-free-tshirt-shop-C3600

    or this one that does various options.

    http://www.zazzle.co.uk/sell/designers


    I tried zazzle because it is in UK (I thought) but while opening the shop I run in this wired W-8BEN formular that they need because they are based in the USA and not in UK. I have no idea how to fill out that formular and I don`t have to pay tax for the shop while I only earn a few Euro`s.
    So I can`t sell on Deviant Art, too because they want this W-8BEN , too...

    It turns out that the only way to make aome money with my renders is to hope a shop in Germany will accept the EULA.

    Post edited by R25S on
  • LeanaLeana Posts: 11,839
    edited December 1969

    Redbubble is another site where you can setup a store to sell tshirts: http://www.redbubble.com/
    They let their members take care of the taxes part themselves (and IIRC they're in Australia), so no W-8BEN form to fill.

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